your opinion on global warming

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 10 Jun 2007 21:12

apoplectic wrote:
Tsiangkun wrote:
and like i said before this earth has had many warm or ice ages before without humans to impact it.whos says this wouldnt happen even without us?
Because it's possible to work out exactly how much relative temperature change there is based on changes in carbon levels, and it's also possible to work out how much carbon we've put into the atmosphere. Of course because of the complicated nature of the climate system, it's impossible to work out what the overall effect will be, but definitely possible to work out what the immediate discrete impact will be.

im not denying that the world is changing, id have to be a retard,but im just saying i doubt its our fault.100 years ago they estimated that we would be long out of oil by now,and look,there is still tons of it,who says this topic wont be just as silly in 100 years?

Actually many experts in the oil industry think that we've either just passed the point of "peak oil" or that we're just about to. Your statement that "100 years ago they estimated that we would be long out of oil by now" is completely false. The theory of peak oil was first presented in 1956, only 51 years ago. Marion Hubbert predicted that oil would reach "peak" stage in the US in 1965-1970, and that it would reach global "peak" stage around 50 years later. Oil reached the peak stage in the US 1970. Hubbert's predictions of what the level of usage today would be (in the same 1956 paper) are almost spot on.

So in fact, there are no experts who think that the original peak oil theory is "silly," and indeed most people in the industry accept that it will have to happen eventually (there is obviously debate about when).

apoplectic · Post by **apoplectic** » 11 Jun 2007 06:04

Pirate Man wrote:
apoplectic wrote:who says this topic wont be just as silly in 100 years?
Anyone who has actually looked at the facts and come to the only reasonable conclusion. You obviously know nothing about global climate change, (or anything else based on your posts in other discussion sections) so I don't understand how you so solidly believe that humans aren't to blame.

ive looked at the fact pirate man.so am i not human or getting something that almost every concivable human here is missing?dont you know that there has been natural climate changes here since the beginning of this earth.so do you have any knowledge worth anything?

apoplectic · Post by **apoplectic** » 11 Jun 2007 06:08

Jeremy wrote: Of course because of the complicated nature of the climate system, it's impossible to work out what the overall effect will be,

so overall our thoeries about global warming could be totally wrong

King Monkey · Post by **King Monkey** » 11 Jun 2007 08:50

Thats a fairly big leap in logic considering all the evidence that exists suggesting it is occuring. Its more likely that fine details of what will happen are indeterminate.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 11 Jun 2007 18:28

apoplectic wrote:
Jeremy wrote: Of course because of the complicated nature of the climate system, it's impossible to work out what the overall effect will be,
so overall our thoeries about global warming could be totally wrong

That's not what I said at all. All the evidence suggests that the theory is correct, and there is no strong evidence supporting the claim that our climate is changing naturally. There are some casual links that "climate sceptics" argue about, but there is nothing in those casual links to suggest a real link. On the other hand, if you fill a jar with co2 and a jar with normal air and leave them sitting in the sun, one is always hotter than the other. And that's really the point I was making, if I did that experiement here, the temperatures would be around 14 degrees C. If I did the same experiment in Broome, they would be around 35 degrees C. In both instances, although the temperatures would be completely different, the co2 jar would be hotter. Whatever the temperature is 100 years from now, it will be hotter than it would have been if we didn't burn so much fossil fuels and cut down so many trees.

apoplectic · Post by **apoplectic** » 13 Jun 2007 05:02

im not saying that co2 isnt a green house gas.im just saying i dont think its the main culpret.sure it cant help,but i think were blaming the wrong thing here.global warm periods happen about every 21,000 years.the last one was 18,000 years ago,not too far apart to be a anomoly.

Switch Kicker · Post by **Switch Kicker** » 13 Jun 2007 06:23

This topic is old, boring, and making no progress. Maybe you should let it die? Just a suggestion.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 13 Jun 2007 18:17

apoplectic wrote:im not saying that co2 isnt a green house gas.im just saying i dont think its the main culpret.sure it cant help,but i think were blaming the wrong thing here.global warm periods happen about every 21,000 years.the last one was 18,000 years ago,not too far apart to be a anomoly.

What is your source for that claim?

This graph shows that 18,000 years ago we were in an ice age...

In fact this website suggests that the last ice age was at its peak 18,000 years ago...

http://www.scotese.com/lastice.htm

Did you look at a temperature graph upside down?

Disturbedboy365 · Post by **Disturbedboy365** » 14 Jun 2007 09:50

to end an ice age, doesnt there have to be a period of global warming?

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 14 Jun 2007 10:12

Sure, but what was suggested was that we had a "global warm period" 18,000 years ago, when in fact the last age lasted from about 70,000 to 10,000 years ago. Also the speed at which the temperatures rose were much slower than the speed at which they're currently rising at. That graph is a little misleading because the scale at the bottom is an exponential scale and not a linear scale.

The temperatures we're seeing today could also be the hottest global temperatures in the last 650,000 years, and the last time we had this kind of massive temperature rise was also because of a very high amount of carbon in the atmosphere. In fact it was probably the same carbon that we're putting into the atmosphere now, because things only cooled down when that carbon was absorbed by plants, and the buried underground, eventually turning into fossil fuels

Disturbedboy365 · Post by **Disturbedboy365** » 14 Jun 2007 10:18

ok lol, i just wanted to point out that both of you could be correct about what was going on 18,000 years ago.

MatS21 · Post by **MatS21** » 15 Jun 2007 16:36

apoplectic wrote:im not saying that co2 isnt a green house gas.im just saying i dont think its the main culpret.sure it cant help,but i think were blaming the wrong thing here.global warm periods happen about every 21,000 years.the last one was 18,000 years ago,not too far apart to be a anomoly.

LOL, this is ridiculous, an ice age global warming and changes in temperature is something that happens over thousands of years. The current changes are happening in few decades.

footjam_heger · Post by **footjam_heger** » 04 Jul 2007 00:07

oh, cool topic here.

dudes, global warming exists! it's true that there were several "warm-periods" in the past, but as far as I know, the temperature never increased that fast.
just look on e.g. a simple chart which showes CO2 emmisions of the past, say, 100-200 years. you'll notice that there was a rapid increase since the industrial revolution (late 18th century - early 19th). is industrial revolution a natural process? not really, ha!?
so please don't tell me human beeing DOES NOT cause global warming! there are sufficient scietific proofs.

whether it's abused for political puropse, I can't say. I just think that wouldn't make sense...
moreover our society is not really willing to change anything. just consumption, fun, amusement.

global warming is a crucial threat everyone faces. if you don't believe in science, it's your problem. you'll see the impacts yourself. I saw impacts. and I'm telling you this is not a natural phenomenon.
our society wants to hear good news. thus important, real critical problems get lost. when people directly are affected by problems it pushes them to act.

if global warming was invented, what would it harm to protect mother nature? there can only be good results. at least I hope so

gMoney · Post by **gMoney** » 04 Jul 2007 08:55

My dad's a right-wing jackass. Which I don't think is a good thing for anybody. You should do your own research and have your own opinions, not let someone else tell you your opinions, which is a big problem of the two party system. Anyways, he says global warming doesn't exists, it's just a way to get democratic votes. First of all, he didn't see an Inconvieniant Truth, second of all he hasn't seen any charts or graphs reguarding global warming. I don't see how it can be a scam to get democratic votes if 1) many republicans believe it's real and 2) the U.N. is doing a report on it. Like the U.N. really gives a shit about petty American politics.

Blue_turnip · Post by **Blue_turnip** » 06 Jul 2007 06:25

gMoney wrote:My dad's a right-wing jackass. Which I don't think is a good thing for anybody. You should do your own research and have your own opinions, not let someone else tell you your opinions, which is a big problem of the two party system. Anyways, he says global warming doesn't exists, it's just a way to get democratic votes. First of all, he didn't see an Inconvieniant Truth, second of all he hasn't seen any charts or graphs reguarding global warming. I don't see how it can be a scam to get democratic votes if 1) many republicans believe it's real and 2) the U.N. is doing a report on it. Like the U.N. really gives a shit about petty American politics.

Good thing you don't agree with your dad.

footjam_heger · Post by **footjam_heger** » 11 Jul 2007 23:07

Blue_turnip wrote:
gMoney wrote:My dad's a right-wing jackass. Which I don't think is a good thing for anybody. You should do your own research and have your own opinions, not let someone else tell you your opinions, which is a big problem of the two party system. Anyways, he says global warming doesn't exists, it's just a way to get democratic votes. First of all, he didn't see an Inconvieniant Truth, second of all he hasn't seen any charts or graphs reguarding global warming. I don't see how it can be a scam to get democratic votes if 1) many republicans believe it's real and 2) the U.N. is doing a report on it. Like the U.N. really gives a shit about petty American politics.
Good thing you don't agree with your dad.

definitely, yeah!

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 12 Jul 2007 09:01

Getting a bit off topic, but the anti global warming documentary "The Great Global Warming Swindle" was shown on Australian TV today. There was a lot of controversy leading up to it, but luckily my hero Tony Jones was on to it, and proceeded to tear the documentary and the director to shreds afterwards. Then there was a panel of experts, which was awesome. There was one scientist - Prof David Karoly - who not only brilliantly destroyed all the arguments against global warming put forward, but also laughed whenever the "sceptics" said something stupid, or even interrupted to say "that's a lie." He's my new hero.

Also the panel finished with audience questions, and the audience had been infiltrated by the Larouche movement, and they are literally mental (I've debated with them on the street a number of times). The best way to sum them up is the fact that the first comment on the website forum for the show was; "What was with the audience, were they all on ice? [high purity crystal meth]"

I think the Larouche movement can be credited with making sure that the majority of people who weren't sure about global warming are now convinced that only crazy people don't believe it exists.

One guy tried to claim that Kepler in the 1600s disproved the method used by the IPCC 400 years later. There were also 4 people who claimed that the environmentalist movement is a front for Nazis trying to wipe out Africa and one guy who just yelled "Carbon 14" over and over.

Good times.

sniper4life · Post by **sniper4life** » 31 Jul 2007 22:47

Globla warmign is bulshit . Lize i tel u!

HighDemonslayer · Post by **HighDemonslayer** » 02 Aug 2007 11:08

Asia's brown clouds 'warm planet'

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6926597.stm

-hds

HighDemonslayer · Post by **HighDemonslayer** » 16 Aug 2007 10:40

Orang-utans home destroyed for bio-diesel

By Thomas Bell in Central Borneo

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.j ... ang114.xml

-hds