Double ATW (DATW)

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Which ATW direction is easier???

in to out
42
58%
out to in
30
42%
 
Total votes: 72

Carlos
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Post by Carlos » 17 Oct 2006 07:52

Ok that last post brought up another question. How the hell do you get better at doing pixies and fairies? I'm all pissed off cause everyone keeps saying this is the easiest move to master but I can't even do it and I've analyzed alot of videos.
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Post by brinard » 17 Oct 2006 08:07

if you dont have at least an okay pixie, i wouldnt even worry about datw.

fairy on the other hand is much harder than pixie...imo

the only way i got better at either set was practice. basically, the same info we gave you for datw, will work for pixie.

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Post by Carlos » 17 Oct 2006 08:17

It does seem like the set>touch the ground with your foot>dex would help a bit with the pixie. Just a little bit frustrated thats all :D
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Post by Jman9089 » 17 Oct 2006 10:12

If you search for pixie in the trick tips I bet you can find a whole crapload of information about it.
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Post by Carlos » 17 Oct 2006 10:14

that's true I really need to make the time to try and search this form better but right now I'm at work so it's going to have to wait until I get home.
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Post by Moxie » 17 Oct 2006 10:29

[Moved from Getting Started to Trick Tips, then merged with the DATW thread here.]
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Post by Moxie » 18 Oct 2006 21:26

(really this time)
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Post by HooD » 18 Oct 2006 22:21

Well for me, it's a split between which variation is easiest. I learned out > in for a long time. I then learned both ways on one side and out > in is equally easy. As for my flip side, out > in has been getting more consistant while in > out is nearly impossible because my legs just do what they want sometimes & my left leg wasn't havin any in > out action.
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Post by footymatt » 24 Oct 2006 09:49

I have found that after the two dexs you can land it on the inside surface almost easier than the toe (bigger stall space). Only thing is that while doing the second dex start turning your foot to the inside, works great feels natural in the foot just not the hip (till you get used to doing it).

As far useing pixie's go, DON'T. Unless your thinking of doing PIXIE ATW. DATW is downtime, doing pixie atw helps to get the idea, but the correct form. Now I just hit DATW this weekend so i'm not anz or anything, but thats where I stand. Oh I also did a lot of practice doing DOD, paradon, stuff like that. I havn't those yet but doing them helped me get the idea for DATW, in fact I tried those other moves a thousand time more datw and datw came to me first. So take it or leave there it is. Later!

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Post by shredzilla » 24 Oct 2006 12:01

man it's weird, I can hit terrage pretty good, but not DATW yet. I'll try it today.

Edit: Got it!
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Double Dex...

Post by jbalexdarkelf » 07 Dec 2006 18:18

... or more specifically Double around the worlds.

I am so close to hitting this I can taste it, but i have a problem...

Either my foot goes to far around (starting its 3rd time) and misses the bag, or it gets it on the foot but it bounces off.

Any suggestions of how to fix these problems?

[merged with other DATW thread - Frank_]
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Post by Jeremy » 08 Dec 2006 05:05

The first tip, which really should go without saying for all moves, is learn the easier components until they're super solid. In this case I'd suggest making sure you can hit atw and clip set ss and far legover/pickup (depending on which direction you're trying to go) really easily. You can definitely hit moves without following this tip, but you'll find them much easier and I think your game will be much better if you do. Of course, not everybody shares my opinion. Personally I would much rather hit a perfect legover than a less than perfect nemesis swirl. My game is obviously a long way away from perfection, but that's the philosophy I've adopted. When I hit moves right, that's awesome, when I hit moves badly, I feel bad. A lot like love I guess.


Anyway...

Some tips for actually hitting the move. It definitely depends on which direction you're trying to hit the move. In any event, and this will be contrary to some people's advice, but I picked it up from Ales, and he's very good at triple atw amongst other moves; Keep your toes hooked up - don't point them. This helps for a few reasons, first it helps get a good straight set - pointing the toes can lead to shanking the set or not getting the right height. Secondly it significantly helps for control. It sounds like control of your leg is part of the problem and keeping the toes hooked should help with this (I think it's because the weight is better distributed, but I'm not sure). Pointing your toes makes your foot go faster, but you lose a bit of control. The other advantage of keeping your feet hooked is that it means you've got 2 less things to do in the move. If you point your toes then you have to point them and unpoint them. I generally think that if you can do a move with less movements, that's better. Jorden Moir once told me that the key to hitting long fearless strings is doing the moves that require the least amount of different things to do in the move. I think this is definitely true for single tricks as well - the less you have to do to hit the trick, the less chance of making a mistake.

My other tip is to count the dexes. Think of it as like a beat 1(set) 2(first dex) 3(second dex) 4(stall). 1,2,3,4 - say them as you do each component. Getting the rhythm right for moves is crucial - pretty much for all moves. DATW has a fairly simple rhythm so this shouldn't be so hard, but you have to feel it as you hit the move. Of course when most people learn a move like this, they don't think about it at all - I know I didn't - but I find pretty much every footbag move a lot easier when I know what rhythm it should have and when I can feel it.

Finally, practice the motion in slow motion without the bag, and then faster and faster until you think it's fast enough. DATW is really not a fast move at all, but it feels like it when you're first learning it. You want to get your leg used to the motion. A lot of people practice with a bottle or something similar on the ground - "dexing" it with their foot. Things like that definitely help.

Most of all, persevere. I have no doubt that you'll hit the move soon, it's just a matter of keeping on trying it until you do. Often the moves that take the longest to hit are the ones that you're most proud of. I hit triple pickup the other day for the first time without much effort at all. I didn't feel like it was a great achievement. However when I hit flipside mobius for the first time (which was over a year ago now) I was totally stoked because even though it's a much easier move than triple pickup, it took a huge amount of effort and it's still fairly hard for me. The people who are good at footbag are the people who work the hardest.

I would say good luck, but you won't need luck and I'm sure you can do it :)

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Post by MatS21 » 08 Dec 2006 10:28

Even if I'm not that good at DATW one thing that helped me get it at first is try to do the dex the smaller possible without touching the bag, if you're too far away you'll need to spin like crazy to get to the bag on time so it will be harder to control. You definitely wan't to have tight dexes and that way you don't need that much speed, if you look in a few pro's video, you'll notice that they don't seem to spin really fast when doing DATW, just tight and timed. Hope that helped.

Edit :

I suggest you reading this topics, it has other helpfuls info.

http://www.modified.in/footbag/viewtopic.php?t=6692

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Double Dexes

Post by Pasquar » 28 Jul 2010 15:47

There's probably a thread on this already, but I'm all kinds of lazy right now

Any suggestions at all for double dexing anything??

It seems to be the one consistent thing I can't really get any trick in (double atw, whirrs, paradon, barfly, barrage). I may sometimes feel like I'm close to a double dexing trick like a barrage for example, but it never fully happens.

For the most part, I usually end up not even dexing around the bag one of two ways.
1. I start dexing way too early and too fast and end up not dexing around the bag at all, or
2. I wait a split second too long and have to try doing both dexes almost completely on the downtime

I've watched the Anz tutorial for it before, but haven't really received any advice I've never heard before. I know WHAT I should be doing, but my legs just won't let me do it :x :x

HELP PLEASE!
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Post by F[uns]tylin' Eclectic » 28 Jul 2010 19:46

Hey Nick! Just saw this, figured I'd give the advice that I can give. Can't recall if we've ever talked about double dex tips. Anyway...

:arrow: Try to start your dex the second the bag leaves your foot, so you have optimal air time on the bag. The earlier you start the first dex, the better.

:arrow: It's not necessarily how fast you dex, it's all timing. If I start my dex too late, the bag will be doing downtime and hit the ground before you even get your second dex in.

:arrow: Make sure you set it in toward you, and straight up into the air, like you're attempting to set it through a tube only big enough for a footbag.

:arrow: Sometimes it helps if you prop yourself up on your toes of the support leg to get you more air time.

:arrow: It helps a lot if you point the toe of your dexing leg, which will also allow for more air time.

Let me know if this helped at all. Go for DATW's first and get them kinda solid, then move onto whirrs or something, because once you get the basic double dex tricks, you'll be ready for bigger ones. And dude, with the form you have when you attempt whirrs, once you learn DATW's, you'll be KILLING whirrs. TRUST ME.

Good luck dude, looking forward to seeing some new double dexes next time we shred!
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Post by PoisonTaffy » 29 Jul 2010 02:55

The tricks you listed are all on different levels of difficulty.. Downtime double dex is not a concept that once you get you can hit everything double. Whirr and datw are not the same at all.

Datw is the easiest downtime double dex I can think of, so concentrate on that.
One advice is to practice the dexing motion by placing a bottle (like a coke bottle) on the floor and 'dexing' around it continuously with your foot, to get used to the smooth circular motion. I've done it a bit but not sure how helpful it is.
Second advice is to really have atw down. Really down. 10 in a row without sweating it. This is to make sure you have great control of the set, which imo is the hardest part of datw.
A third advice which I don't recall reading but I often use when learning a double dex move, is to do the dexes and not worry about the catch. Just double dex and don't even try stalling afterwards. You know you're going to drop so you're not as tense, and not worrying about the final motion gives you extra time to complete the double dex. Once you complete a few good double dexes, your muscles should know the movement better and you'll be able to add the stall.

If you're especially interested in barrage, i can only recommend doing it from clipper. Way easier than toe.

Take into account that I'm not a great player and definitely not an authority on double dexes, just getting the debate started so someone with more authority will pop up and share some advice of their own.
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Post by F[uns]tylin' Eclectic » 29 Jul 2010 06:45

PoisonTaffy wrote: Whirr and datw are not the same at all.
They are in the sense that your leg dexes the bag twice. :roll:
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Post by PoisonTaffy » 29 Jul 2010 10:38

Technically, yes, but for most practical matters I wouldn't group these two specifically together. Same as I wouldn't group whirl and mirage, even though they share more than whirr and datw.
Contemplating on this today I guess the rest have more in common, but I still wouldn't worry about barfly just yet.
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Post by Frank_Sinatra » 30 Jul 2010 08:01

Sick*Nick*Slick*Kick wrote: :arrow: Sometimes it helps if you prop yourself up on your toes of the support leg to get you more air time.

:arrow: It helps a lot if you point the toe of your dexing leg, which will also allow for more air time.
Really agree with these tips. Although I'd say I always get fully extended onto the toes of my support leg on double dexes. On the second tip - pointing may be helpful & I think usually looks better, but doing what comes naturally for you or feels right for you is probably the best way to go.

Like Roy said, each family of double dex tricks is really different. I can terrage all day but I'm miles away from whirr.

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Post by Pasquar » 30 Jul 2010 15:17

thanks for the advice guys, about to try some out in a few minutes.

But I have tried pointing my toe and I personally thing it doesn't help me out, it kinda loses me a little more actually.

And I know that datw and whirr are not in the same family of tricks, but I started this thread because I've noticed a pattern that ANY trick with a double dex (no matter what "family" it may belong to) gives me trouble, and it's a bit aggravating

I'm gonna go try some datws now, fingers xed
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