hacky sack millionaires

[Tsiangkun]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L80R9UoswV0[/youtube]

[PacLoc]

That's pretty funny. He did a pretty nice legover in there. Kicking the chicken wing to his mouth was pretty impressive too.

[Max Power]

I'm gonna school my dirty raisins. This is great, thanks for sharing. I'm gonna get one of those hats. "Lil' wayne wants to borrow my vcr" "my feet are like black ass trumpets in socks"

[Pasquar]

Gonna say the same thing I did when this was posted on Facebook.

I'm sad that this exists and I don't think white people understand the subtlety of their racism.

[Jeremy]

It's a parody of stereotypes, not a documentary.

Anyway I found them hilarious. There's a whole series.

[Outsider]

I don't think white people understand the subtlety of their racism.

I won't speak for others, but I for one will admit that subtlety is not my strong suit. Things like that often go right over my head. But, since you have brought it up, please elaborate on this subtle racism so that I may benefit.

[DubleDex]

Doing a little research into where this was posted and who's promoting it, I get the impression that this is more "Black people making fun of white people for how they make fun of black people." Maybe that's a little convoluted, and maybe the subtlety of the humor ultimately ends up contributing to racism in some way because someone takes it too seriously.

Ultimately it is parody (which doesn't automatically mean it isn't racist or exclude it from critical review and interpretation), and I think it was meant to (primarily get a laugh and) show how ridiculous some stereotypes are.

[Pasquar]

I won't speak for others, but I for one will admit that subtlety is not my strong suit. Things like that often go right over my head. But, since you have brought it up, please elaborate on this subtle racism so that I may benefit.

It's hard to describe, but I think what DubleDex said: "Black people making fun of white people for how they make fun of black people." probably explains it best. I know this is parody, I'm not saying that it's not, it's just that things in this video from the N-word to eating fried chicken while playing to the line "I made more $ this year than my grandparents, 'cuz they were slaves" is just way to perpetuate stereotypes via a black person who plays hacky sack. I feel the people who made this were in a sense trying to poke fun at there being next to no black people who play and then going really far with it. I think the video was originally meant to entertain people who weren't into hacky sack or footbag, but then the footbag community (which is almost completely white) sees it and thinks it's funny. This is the central point that irks me: that now it's the white footbag community spreading this around when I don't think it was intended for this audience to begin with.

When this discussion was up on Facebook, people related it to Dave Chapelle as he would frequently use racist/stereotypical things in his skits. I think it's related because I feel Chapelle's intended audience was mostly black, and I personally feel that if people are poking fun at stereotypes within their race, it's okay, but it's another thing when a white person tags along, then it can become implicitly racist. Another example is the N-word. It was originally used to degrade black people, but then they turned it around and owned it. I dare anyone on this forum to say the N-word around black people and see what happens.

Though to a lesser degree, I view this as sort of the same thing.

[Jeremy]

Oh no, white people finding black people's parodys funny. So racist. Jon and I are racial minorities. Is it OK if we're amused, or are African Americans the only people allowed to get the joke?

[Outsider]

Now now, don't be hating, Jer.

After getting Nick P's point of view, and talking this over more with a friend, I think it is at least worth considering what Nick has to say and bearing in mind that this all can be seen from more then one point of view. While I still think the videos are pretty funny... just imagine to possibilties: Nick is right that there are a tiny number of black footbag players. Multiple years go by when I don't play with any at all. Even though some other racial minorities are often present, they are still almost always very much in the minority = badly outnumbered... Now I can imagine right away that the next African American footbag player that I meet could get humorously called Blackie-Sack or Leon Sugarfoot by the rest of us, by his friends, and maybe he'd find it funny too, but then, maybe that joke gets old quick for him and the joke goes on for too long... its all a matter of your point of view.

I'm not for denouncing this video --- I think it's good funny stuff. But, I'd say its best to keep in mind that there can be other points of view on this, and those other points of view are not wrong... maybe they're even more worthwhile than our own point of view, if only as a matter of degree, and perhaps that is all Nick P is trying to say.

Thanks Nick for the added point of view.

[Jeremy]

I doubt that the makers of this have much idea about the demographics in footbag, or are making a point about that. They're just juxtaposing gangsta rap culture with something completely out of place.

Of course all parodies of racism run the risk of being mistaken as serious by racists. That doesn't make the parody racist though, it just reflects the intellectual abilities of some racists. When you consider the completely irrelevant things that get used as ammo for racists, if you deemed things racist based on their use by racists, you'd probably be labelling half of all culture racist.

I disagree that "other points of view are not wrong." Certainly that's sometimes the case, but plenty are clearly wrong, and plenty are in mutual conflict to a degree that even if we don't know which is wrong, we know that at least one must be. In this case, my point of view is that this video is not at all racist, while Nick's point of view is that it is. At least one of us must be wrong.

[Pasquar]

I'm Jeremy and everything must be so cut & dry/ black & white to fit into my myopic view that I am right about everything and whoever disagrees or offers and alternative view is wrong.

[DubleDex]

If every single person had to consider how small-minded and unintelligent people would take or use something, then nothing would ever be created. Unfortunately, there are plenty of people who will take any thing that is created and distort it to be used as ammunition that reinforces their view of stereotypes or whatever. It's how the world works.

And, quite frankly, once something is in the public's hands it is open to interpretation however they see fit, regardless of the creator's intentions (take for instance the number of people who claim that Horton Hears a Who is an anti-abortion parable, even though Dr. Suess, and now his estate, continue to clearly state that this is not true, it was not his intended purpose, and not what he was thinking while writing the story).

The important thing, really, is to make sure there are still plenty of people who are willing to intelligently discuss and debate all the things in the world around us.

In this case, given that this video was created by African Americans (is that term racist, since there are plenty of black people in the US who have virtually no connection to Africa? Is the term black racist now?), featured African Americans and was distributed by a prominent African American's company, I find it hard to believe that the intent was to be racist. However, that doesn't mean that some backwoods redneck (wait... is that racist? Probably not, but it's certainly a stereotype and there are surely plenty of cosmopolitan, suit-wearing individuals who will have the same reaction) isn't going to watch this video and feel that it confirms all his beliefs about how black people act and eat and behave.

None of that should deter creative individuals from making things that they believe in. Nor should it prevent people from being amused by something that was clearly intended to be humorous. Nor does it excuse those who choose to use it to further racist propaganda. It just means we should all try a little harder to be cognizant of other viewpoints and potential pitfalls of the things we do.

[Jeremy]

I'm Nick and I resort to strawman arguments and personal attacks when people disagree with my dogmatic ideology rather than attempting to defend my claims on their merits.

[Jazzkid]

thought Id help .....

Its definitely funny.


Hope that helps

[Alex Dworetzky]

i like racism, but thats just me

[C-Fan]

I still haven't seen the video, but this comment jumped out at me:

In this case, given that this video was created by African Americans (is that term racist, since there are plenty of black people in the US who have virtually no connection to Africa? Is the term black racist now?), featured African Americans and was distributed by a prominent African American's company, I find it hard to believe that the intent was to be racist. However, that doesn't mean that some backwoods redneck (wait... is that racist? Probably not, but it's certainly a stereotype and there are surely plenty of cosmopolitan, suit-wearing individuals who will have the same reaction) isn't going to watch this video and feel that it confirms all his beliefs about how black people act and eat and behave.

I think this gets to the root of the debate. Art isn't an object or an image. Art is the interaction between an observer and an object or image. That interaction is impossible to control, and varies depending who the observer is. Dave Chappelle's show was wildly successful, but he ended up being conflicted and walking away from it, because he didn't feel comfortable about why it was successful. He was making jokes and sketches making fun of racism, but he worried that the show was being embraced by racists who didn't get that. Basically, he was concerned that people were laughing at him, and not with him. It sounds like this video is similar.

Long story short, I think its important to look at the creators of the art and ask what their motivations and goals are, but its just as important to look at our own reactions and ask ourselves why we are reacting the way we are.

[Jeremy]

I haven't seen anybody responding to this in a racist manner, unless you count Nick's generalisation about white people in his first post. All I've seen are people who think it's hilarious, and one person who thinks it's racist. I tend to think outrage on behalf of other people is often a problem that gives misleading impressions of the qualities of the target. A group of black people make a video parodying a black subculture, and one white, middle class communist thinks it's racist in the midst of a group of racial minorities.

[Pasquar]

I'm Jeremy and I resort to strawman arguments and personal attacks when people disagree with my dogmatic ideology rather than attempting to defend my claims on their merits....

I think it's ironic how you say I resort to personal attacks and you do the exact same thing.

From the beginning I have been stating an opinion. OPINION Jeremy, understand that. The main disparity between us is that I feel there can be differing opinions and still have meaningful dialogue whereas you think that what you think constitutes fact, meaning there is no point in dialogue because you're right.

[h0ag3yb3atZ]

as a rarely offended honky white devil, i naturally died laughing throughout the whole thing and watched every episode in one sitting.

also grew up watching chapelles show and never asked my teacher if there was any homework tonight, which is probably why this is funny to me.