http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVZczLuoJoU
FTW.
Jeremy
-
Outsider
- Ayatollah of Rock n' Rollah
- Posts: 1373
- Joined: 21 May 2003 21:30
- Location: Bridgewater, New Jersey
Awesome! ...
But...
So disappointed that there isn't more of this
Anyway, thanks. I was initially wondering if it would be worth watching all six minutes, but the end credits were definitely worthy. Start to finish it really did seem pro enough that I thought there really would be more episodes.
"The time has come to convert the unbelievers..."
Jonathan Schneider --- sometimes showers with his Lavers on (to clean them)
The Ministry of Silly Walks
NYFA
BAP
Jonathan Schneider --- sometimes showers with his Lavers on (to clean them)
The Ministry of Silly Walks
NYFA
BAP
Yeah it's just so good, cause I totally would be the red rose atheist avenger too.
So touch today; went good - 7 vs 5 win I think. They were rubbish, but all really fit guys, had more pace than anybody on our team I think. Just no idea how to play. They scored the first try of the game by running straight to the wing and outside one of our slow girls. I get the ball back and score a try. They get it and run straight to the wing and around one of how girls. I'm a little angry about this take two touches and then step the guy who scored both those tries and another guy and score. They score essentially the same way a third time (except from an intercept pass from their defensive line
), I come on, run from half set up a third score - 3 all. From this point, we figured out their "attacking move" and just squeezed hard across whichever way they went, and they score 2 more tries to the game, compared with our 4. I ended up with 3 tries and 1 assists. Unfortunately in the first half I lost a big scab on my elbow from the week before and you wouldn't believe how much it bled. I got blood on half the opposition and didn't even notice until I was walking off at half time. I bandaged it up then, so it was all good. I also grazed my knee and my ankle, so it was a bit of a blood sport. Hilarious getting blood on other people, not so funny when they get it on you... 
Reffed a game afterwards and cramped up while reffing - major blow. I may well have cost one of the teams the win at that stage because I fell over and my view of the play was obscured by another player, and apparently there was a massive touch pass that I missed, and they scored just after that. Still not much I could have done.
Still it's good to note our team of 9 people who have never played before, plus my brother and I, now haven't lost a game since round 1. Of course we've got a Kevin Rudd style roster (ie. awesome), and don't have to play one of the two teams that look like easily the best teams in the comp until round 12, which is next year. We've just finished round 8. Although rounds 10 and 11 could be close, as they're both against teams that were dropped down a division, so they might be pretty strong.
Massive weekend planned. My only blow is that I had to turn down getting hammered playing golf because of too many commitments. Summer is really here though, so good.
So touch today; went good - 7 vs 5 win I think. They were rubbish, but all really fit guys, had more pace than anybody on our team I think. Just no idea how to play. They scored the first try of the game by running straight to the wing and outside one of our slow girls. I get the ball back and score a try. They get it and run straight to the wing and around one of how girls. I'm a little angry about this take two touches and then step the guy who scored both those tries and another guy and score. They score essentially the same way a third time (except from an intercept pass from their defensive line
), I come on, run from half set up a third score - 3 all. From this point, we figured out their "attacking move" and just squeezed hard across whichever way they went, and they score 2 more tries to the game, compared with our 4. I ended up with 3 tries and 1 assists. Unfortunately in the first half I lost a big scab on my elbow from the week before and you wouldn't believe how much it bled. I got blood on half the opposition and didn't even notice until I was walking off at half time. I bandaged it up then, so it was all good. I also grazed my knee and my ankle, so it was a bit of a blood sport. Hilarious getting blood on other people, not so funny when they get it on you... Reffed a game afterwards and cramped up while reffing - major blow. I may well have cost one of the teams the win at that stage because I fell over and my view of the play was obscured by another player, and apparently there was a massive touch pass that I missed, and they scored just after that. Still not much I could have done.
Still it's good to note our team of 9 people who have never played before, plus my brother and I, now haven't lost a game since round 1. Of course we've got a Kevin Rudd style roster (ie. awesome), and don't have to play one of the two teams that look like easily the best teams in the comp until round 12, which is next year. We've just finished round 8. Although rounds 10 and 11 could be close, as they're both against teams that were dropped down a division, so they might be pretty strong.
Massive weekend planned. My only blow is that I had to turn down getting hammered playing golf because of too many commitments. Summer is really here though, so good.
Why I dislike Steve Irwin;
A few people asked this, and I couldn't be bothered starting a topic about this, but I thought I'd explain.
My dislike for Steve Irwin was really a knee jerk emotional reaction. He wasn't that bad a guy, in fact he was probably a nice guy with a "good heart" who was just misguided. I did enjoy watching his shows for a while, although watched them very rarely - but only because he was mental.
Anyway to dive straight in, two Australians were locked up in Guantánamo Bay after being captured in the Middle East. While the treatment of both was completely immoral and a breach of international law and human rights, one of them, David Hicks, was clearly guilty at least of "fighting" for the Taliban in Afghanistan. I put "fighting" in inverted commas because he never actually did any fighting, but he would have if he the US had have attacked that tank he was guarding, or if he hadn't changed his mind and been arrested trying to flee the country.
However the other one, Mamdouh Habib, has a completely different story.
Mamdouh Habib was arrested on a bus in Pakistan which was stopped because two Germans who had been in Afghanistan were on it. He was taken to Egypt and then Afghanistan where he alleges he was tortured. He was then taken to Guantánamo. No evidence has been presented that he had any links to any terrorist organisation, or that he'd ever been in Afghanistan, or that he had any connection to the two Germans. The Germans were released shortly after their arrest, but Habib, who was arrested because they thought he had some connection with those Germans was kept in jail for 5 years.
It was a shocking piece of injustice, and made worse by the previous government doing absolutely nothing to bring him back to Australia, find out why he was arrested or defend his rights in any way.
In 2003 George W Bush came to Australia and spoke at a joint sitting of parliament. Politicians were allowed to invite a guest to sit in the chambers (since they would be completely packed out). Bob Brown, the leader of the Australian Greens (and who lives and works quite nearby to my work), brought in Ahmed Habib, Mamdouh's son. Ahmed was escorted out after yelling at President Shrub; "What about my dad's rights?" and Bob Brown was also asked to leave (but stayed anyway) after interrupting George's speech to also ask about Habib. It was a bit sad to see that only 2 out of 226 elected Australian politicians were prepared to stand up and complain about the gross human rights abuses of an Australian citizen, and surely part of the purpose of a government is to protect its citizens. Both Habib and Hicks were helped far more by Americans than they were by the Australian government (although there was very high public support for both, but nobodies going to vote on an issue like that) - hence the reason why I had Major Michael Mori (A US soldier and Hicks' defence lawyer) as my avatar for a year or two, despite apparently being so "anti-American" according to the forum illiterates.
Anyway just after Bob made his interruptions Steve Irwin met our Prime Minister and when asked about it, he not only gave his strong support for the PM (who was truely an evil man who left the country after being in power for 11 years with massive budget surpluses but no investments for the future at all - all public services suffered under him, and we have nothing to show for those 11 years of economic boom) but when asked about Bob Brown's interjection, he said; "Somebody should punch him in the head."
This sparked a massive dislike for Steve Irwin in me, definitely disproportionate, but I was very frustrated with our governments shameful behaviour, and to hear somebody criticising one of the few people in Australian politics with a conscious in such a crass manner really annoyed me.
Of course from that point I learnt more about him that made me dislike him; particularly his opposition to pro-environmental legislation a number of times because it was going to harm his business. My impression is that he was much less of an environmentalist than he pretended to be in the media. However after he died, seeing some of his stuff on TV, I started to think that maybe he was just fairly stupid, and hadn't thought about his actions or what he said very much. This is certainly backed up by his behaviour, especially that ludicrous time when he took his son Bob into the crocodile pen.
So yeah, it's got nothing to do with the image he gave Australia. If people are so ignorant they think that there are people like that, then I don't really care much about the opinions of those people. Of course there are people in Australia who won't go to the US because they're afraid they'll be murdered, so there are obviously ignorant people all around the world.
A few people asked this, and I couldn't be bothered starting a topic about this, but I thought I'd explain.
My dislike for Steve Irwin was really a knee jerk emotional reaction. He wasn't that bad a guy, in fact he was probably a nice guy with a "good heart" who was just misguided. I did enjoy watching his shows for a while, although watched them very rarely - but only because he was mental.
Anyway to dive straight in, two Australians were locked up in Guantánamo Bay after being captured in the Middle East. While the treatment of both was completely immoral and a breach of international law and human rights, one of them, David Hicks, was clearly guilty at least of "fighting" for the Taliban in Afghanistan. I put "fighting" in inverted commas because he never actually did any fighting, but he would have if he the US had have attacked that tank he was guarding, or if he hadn't changed his mind and been arrested trying to flee the country.
However the other one, Mamdouh Habib, has a completely different story.
Mamdouh Habib was arrested on a bus in Pakistan which was stopped because two Germans who had been in Afghanistan were on it. He was taken to Egypt and then Afghanistan where he alleges he was tortured. He was then taken to Guantánamo. No evidence has been presented that he had any links to any terrorist organisation, or that he'd ever been in Afghanistan, or that he had any connection to the two Germans. The Germans were released shortly after their arrest, but Habib, who was arrested because they thought he had some connection with those Germans was kept in jail for 5 years.
It was a shocking piece of injustice, and made worse by the previous government doing absolutely nothing to bring him back to Australia, find out why he was arrested or defend his rights in any way.
In 2003 George W Bush came to Australia and spoke at a joint sitting of parliament. Politicians were allowed to invite a guest to sit in the chambers (since they would be completely packed out). Bob Brown, the leader of the Australian Greens (and who lives and works quite nearby to my work), brought in Ahmed Habib, Mamdouh's son. Ahmed was escorted out after yelling at President Shrub; "What about my dad's rights?" and Bob Brown was also asked to leave (but stayed anyway) after interrupting George's speech to also ask about Habib. It was a bit sad to see that only 2 out of 226 elected Australian politicians were prepared to stand up and complain about the gross human rights abuses of an Australian citizen, and surely part of the purpose of a government is to protect its citizens. Both Habib and Hicks were helped far more by Americans than they were by the Australian government (although there was very high public support for both, but nobodies going to vote on an issue like that) - hence the reason why I had Major Michael Mori (A US soldier and Hicks' defence lawyer) as my avatar for a year or two, despite apparently being so "anti-American" according to the forum illiterates.
Anyway just after Bob made his interruptions Steve Irwin met our Prime Minister and when asked about it, he not only gave his strong support for the PM (who was truely an evil man who left the country after being in power for 11 years with massive budget surpluses but no investments for the future at all - all public services suffered under him, and we have nothing to show for those 11 years of economic boom) but when asked about Bob Brown's interjection, he said; "Somebody should punch him in the head."
This sparked a massive dislike for Steve Irwin in me, definitely disproportionate, but I was very frustrated with our governments shameful behaviour, and to hear somebody criticising one of the few people in Australian politics with a conscious in such a crass manner really annoyed me.
Of course from that point I learnt more about him that made me dislike him; particularly his opposition to pro-environmental legislation a number of times because it was going to harm his business. My impression is that he was much less of an environmentalist than he pretended to be in the media. However after he died, seeing some of his stuff on TV, I started to think that maybe he was just fairly stupid, and hadn't thought about his actions or what he said very much. This is certainly backed up by his behaviour, especially that ludicrous time when he took his son Bob into the crocodile pen.
So yeah, it's got nothing to do with the image he gave Australia. If people are so ignorant they think that there are people like that, then I don't really care much about the opinions of those people. Of course there are people in Australia who won't go to the US because they're afraid they'll be murdered, so there are obviously ignorant people all around the world.
Hey I'm going to be on the radio 
Discussing "the atheist books" - a friend of mine has an hour book show, and she wants me to come in and talk about my growing collection
Here are the books I'll bring in;
The God Delusion - Richard Dawkins
God is not Great; How Religion Poisons Everything - Christopher Hitchens
The End Of Faith - Sam Harris
Letter To A Christian Nation - Sam Harris
The Atheist Manifesto - Michel Onfray
God; The Failed Hypothesis - Victor Strenger
Breaking The Spell - Daniel Dennett
Six Impossible Things Before Breakfast - Lewis Wolpert
I'll also bring in Creation - by E O Wilson, which should be compulsory reading for everybody.
Edit; Also will discuss Northern Lights by Philip Pullman - (aka "The Golden Compass" - which I own but haven't read yet). A fantastic example of the ridiculous irrationalism of religion.
Discussing "the atheist books" - a friend of mine has an hour book show, and she wants me to come in and talk about my growing collection
Here are the books I'll bring in;
The God Delusion - Richard Dawkins
God is not Great; How Religion Poisons Everything - Christopher Hitchens
The End Of Faith - Sam Harris
Letter To A Christian Nation - Sam Harris
The Atheist Manifesto - Michel Onfray
God; The Failed Hypothesis - Victor Strenger
Breaking The Spell - Daniel Dennett
Six Impossible Things Before Breakfast - Lewis Wolpert
I'll also bring in Creation - by E O Wilson, which should be compulsory reading for everybody.
Edit; Also will discuss Northern Lights by Philip Pullman - (aka "The Golden Compass" - which I own but haven't read yet). A fantastic example of the ridiculous irrationalism of religion.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hj--fCSNrLc
I think I might go around door knocking and singing this Christmas Carol this year. I'll just target the houses with Christmas lights up.
I think I might go around door knocking and singing this Christmas Carol this year. I'll just target the houses with Christmas lights up.
So had a good kick today down at the markets with Raf and Brian. I was planning on doing some filming but very frustratingly I somehow managed to fuck up charging my ipod speakers last night, and they batteries ran out, and I didn't want to play without music (in fact if you look carefully at the last video I made, you'll see I'm playing while holding my ipod, with the cord wrapped around my arm, so it doesn't swing around - believe me I tried a bunch of other ideas before going with that option, but I just struggle to do anything apart from drills without music). I did play well though, although kept my boardshorts on since we weren't filming. Raf read some Mark Twain to make up for the lack of music though, which was probably more entertaining. I was hitting some nice length runs, but not hard stuff. Probably the most difficult thing was pdx drifter>pdx torque repeat, but I first hit that like 3 years ago, so not really amazing. I think my flip pdx torque is stronger than my flip torque, which is a little embarrassing.
There was a massive motorcycle thing today too, which I found annoying. Basically every motorcyclist in the state gets a couple of toys, drives down to the market where I play footbag and put the toys in the back of trucks where they are then distributed around the state to under privileged kids. While I guess you can say it's a good cause, in these times of high oil prices and global warming, it's easy to think of better ways of doing "good" for the world then spending all that money driving 300km return to put two teddybears in a truck, which then drives 300km back up to where you'd driven from to give the teddybears to a kid who lives in the same street.
It's a very symbolic charity I guess, rather than at all practical.
Anyway a few thousand motorcycles driving past you while playing footbag is probably not the most ideal environment for maintaining concentration.
Work dinner tonight though, so that will be good.
There was a massive motorcycle thing today too, which I found annoying. Basically every motorcyclist in the state gets a couple of toys, drives down to the market where I play footbag and put the toys in the back of trucks where they are then distributed around the state to under privileged kids. While I guess you can say it's a good cause, in these times of high oil prices and global warming, it's easy to think of better ways of doing "good" for the world then spending all that money driving 300km return to put two teddybears in a truck, which then drives 300km back up to where you'd driven from to give the teddybears to a kid who lives in the same street.
It's a very symbolic charity I guess, rather than at all practical.
Anyway a few thousand motorcycles driving past you while playing footbag is probably not the most ideal environment for maintaining concentration.
Work dinner tonight though, so that will be good.
.
... footbag, friends, rolly tobacco, and coffee Have you given up smoking and coffee?
Cheers anyway, it's a lot of fun taking photos of insects, but so frustrating as well, because most of the time they're moving, you have to take so many photos to get a good one. Over 75% of my photos are rubbish - but luckily I can take about 500 hundred before I need to start worrying about running out of space.
Here is an uncompressed version of one of the ones above, because somebody was asking me about it. Sorry about wrecking the borders.
In case you're wondering, the spider is about 1 cm big.
Cheers anyway, it's a lot of fun taking photos of insects, but so frustrating as well, because most of the time they're moving, you have to take so many photos to get a good one. Over 75% of my photos are rubbish - but luckily I can take about 500 hundred before I need to start worrying about running out of space.
Here is an uncompressed version of one of the ones above, because somebody was asking me about it. Sorry about wrecking the borders.
In case you're wondering, the spider is about 1 cm big.
-
lotus
- Multidex Master
- Posts: 295
- Joined: 16 Apr 2007 04:50
- Location: Western Australia, Australia
- Contact:
great photos jeremy 
... you really are getting down there amongst it eh!?
regarding your reply to my previous post, i certainly have NOT given up ANY of the things on that salamanca list ... i just miss doing them at salamanca
. salamanca was my weekly excuse to enter the world of people, and i don't have that same social outlet over here ... i still brew myself at least one KILLER coffee a day, and bum a rolly when possible (never ever buy tobacco).
you may be pleased to know that i have had a footbag REBIRTH and have decided to take my game back to its base and correct my clipper inadequacies, so that i may move forward ... at 34 ...
.
plenty of left clipper > left clipper > left clipper > right clipper > right clipper > right clipper > rpt ... also left clipper > left clipper > paradox legover > left clipper > paradox mirage > right clipper > right clipper > paradox legover > right clipper > paradox mirage ... i really feel like i'm getting the clipper on the left side of my body much stronger (or at least existant)!!
also been consistently hitting things like DATW, double legover, ducking + dex, and even a few osis ... do you think there's hope for me yet?
... you really are getting down there amongst it eh!?regarding your reply to my previous post, i certainly have NOT given up ANY of the things on that salamanca list ... i just miss doing them at salamanca
. salamanca was my weekly excuse to enter the world of people, and i don't have that same social outlet over here ... i still brew myself at least one KILLER coffee a day, and bum a rolly when possible (never ever buy tobacco).you may be pleased to know that i have had a footbag REBIRTH and have decided to take my game back to its base and correct my clipper inadequacies, so that i may move forward ... at 34 ...
.plenty of left clipper > left clipper > left clipper > right clipper > right clipper > right clipper > rpt ... also left clipper > left clipper > paradox legover > left clipper > paradox mirage > right clipper > right clipper > paradox legover > right clipper > paradox mirage ... i really feel like i'm getting the clipper on the left side of my body much stronger (or at least existant)!!
also been consistently hitting things like DATW, double legover, ducking + dex, and even a few osis ... do you think there's hope for me yet
?There's definitely hope for you, especially given the control you currently have of your legs. I'd be confident that you could easily massively improve your game with some regular training, given your strong foundation. 34 is not old at all. That's great news about your training too
The political party I'm an active member of made it into a very highly respected national paper today.
Not a very flattening article, and misrepresents us quite badly, but I think the publicity will help us a lot
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/st ... 04,00.html
I loved this quote;
"But there is "no doubt that those who want religion banished from the public square on the grounds that theistic beliefs are intellectually vacuous, morally bankrupt, politically dangerous and socially divisive are increasing in number and in voice throughout the world"."
The political party I'm an active member of made it into a very highly respected national paper today.
Not a very flattening article, and misrepresents us quite badly, but I think the publicity will help us a lot
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/st ... 04,00.html
I loved this quote;
"But there is "no doubt that those who want religion banished from the public square on the grounds that theistic beliefs are intellectually vacuous, morally bankrupt, politically dangerous and socially divisive are increasing in number and in voice throughout the world"."
So sorry if this is a drunken raving post.
I went out tonight after work with a good friend. It was his shout all night, because although he earns more money than me, he's in a lot of debt, and I'm not, so I usually shout him. We played lots of pool at a local cocktail bar, which was completely empty and then moved into the city and ended up going to a pool hall which is open pretty much all night.
This place - The Welcome Stranger - probably has a reputation of being the second most violent place in all of Hobart. Certainly although until tonight I've never seen any violence there, most people I know have. Anyway we were playing pool. Garry and I both play a lot of pool, so it was mainly good games - we ended up playing 11 games in total I think.
Right at the end of the last game this girl at the other end of the room starts yelling. We both look up, and then Garry gets a beer or something and I keep watching. She's yelling at this guy and being held back by another guy, who then pushes her behind him and starts saying something to the other guy. This goes on for a little while, then out of no where the guy who was yelling at the girl right hooks the other guy to the floor, yells something like "who else wants a go?" grabs a pool ball off the table and starts smashing the other guys head in with it. I turn around yell at the bouncer, pick up my phone and call the cops. The bouncer jumps the bar runs over, drags the guy away. Things settle down for a moment, then the guy on the ground, bleeding everywhere, clearly concussed, gets up and stumbles towards the guy who just beat him up. The guy who beat him up takes off his shirt (why would you do that?) and tries to pushes past the bouncer and then wrestles with the concussed guy. The bouncer drags the guy away and pushes him out the fire exit. Things calm down for a minute, and then suddenly the girl the fight was over pulls out a knife and starts trying to, I'm not sure, maybe stab the bouncer. At that moment the cops arrive, pull out their guns and tell her to drop the knife. She does. The guy who was beaten up collapses and an ambulance arrives and takes him away. He's regained consciousness and is tries to walk away saying that he's fine. About 15 police arrive at the scene. They interview a few people, including me, but don't write much down. I guess we all say the same thing, and then I leave.
I don't think I'm ever going back to that place again.
I just don't understand why, when somebody is basically unconscious on the ground, and another guy is standing over him beating his head in with a pool ball, why everybody else just stood and watched. Why was I the only person to get try and get the bouncer and why was I the only person to pull out a phone and call the police? Actually my friend Garry missed the entire thing, and says to me afterwards; "Why's he bleeding? What happened." I guess that's an even bigger mystery - how could you miss a "fight" like that?
I went out tonight after work with a good friend. It was his shout all night, because although he earns more money than me, he's in a lot of debt, and I'm not, so I usually shout him. We played lots of pool at a local cocktail bar, which was completely empty and then moved into the city and ended up going to a pool hall which is open pretty much all night.
This place - The Welcome Stranger - probably has a reputation of being the second most violent place in all of Hobart. Certainly although until tonight I've never seen any violence there, most people I know have. Anyway we were playing pool. Garry and I both play a lot of pool, so it was mainly good games - we ended up playing 11 games in total I think.
Right at the end of the last game this girl at the other end of the room starts yelling. We both look up, and then Garry gets a beer or something and I keep watching. She's yelling at this guy and being held back by another guy, who then pushes her behind him and starts saying something to the other guy. This goes on for a little while, then out of no where the guy who was yelling at the girl right hooks the other guy to the floor, yells something like "who else wants a go?" grabs a pool ball off the table and starts smashing the other guys head in with it. I turn around yell at the bouncer, pick up my phone and call the cops. The bouncer jumps the bar runs over, drags the guy away. Things settle down for a moment, then the guy on the ground, bleeding everywhere, clearly concussed, gets up and stumbles towards the guy who just beat him up. The guy who beat him up takes off his shirt (why would you do that?) and tries to pushes past the bouncer and then wrestles with the concussed guy. The bouncer drags the guy away and pushes him out the fire exit. Things calm down for a minute, and then suddenly the girl the fight was over pulls out a knife and starts trying to, I'm not sure, maybe stab the bouncer. At that moment the cops arrive, pull out their guns and tell her to drop the knife. She does. The guy who was beaten up collapses and an ambulance arrives and takes him away. He's regained consciousness and is tries to walk away saying that he's fine. About 15 police arrive at the scene. They interview a few people, including me, but don't write much down. I guess we all say the same thing, and then I leave.
I don't think I'm ever going back to that place again.
I just don't understand why, when somebody is basically unconscious on the ground, and another guy is standing over him beating his head in with a pool ball, why everybody else just stood and watched. Why was I the only person to get try and get the bouncer and why was I the only person to pull out a phone and call the police? Actually my friend Garry missed the entire thing, and says to me afterwards; "Why's he bleeding? What happened." I guess that's an even bigger mystery - how could you miss a "fight" like that?
-
james_dean
- space cowboy
- Posts: 2268
- Joined: 26 Oct 2004 23:11
- Location: Bendigo, Vic, Australia
First off all - messed up, I just don't understand violence like that.
There was some study, can't remember what it was, but some girl was chased and murded in a city in america, and heaps of people heard her? But no one called the cops. Anyway they decided that it was because so many people saw/heard it that no one called. Everyone thought someone else was doing it, there was a seperation of responsibility cause everyone saw it.
I think that's how it went.
And I suppose Garry missed it cause.. it's loud in pubs? I dunno.
There was some study, can't remember what it was, but some girl was chased and murded in a city in america, and heaps of people heard her? But no one called the cops. Anyway they decided that it was because so many people saw/heard it that no one called. Everyone thought someone else was doing it, there was a seperation of responsibility cause everyone saw it.
I think that's how it went.
And I suppose Garry missed it cause.. it's loud in pubs? I dunno.
