Transformers!

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Zeke
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Post by Zeke »

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Switch Kicker wrote:
Zeke wrote:Holy
Zeke wrote:Shit

that is to say that I thoroughly enjoyed this movie
You like it that much too?
Oh yeah. I was not disappointed at all and was completely entertained. I was really impressed by the robot designs. I personally like when looks are adapted for the screen as long as they stay true to the characters (X-men is a good example). I guess I would have been fine if they had stayed true to the iconic images of the classic cartoons but they were robots first, then adapted to blend in with our world and should not look like trucks with arms and legs. The designs looked very advanced and well developed. The animation and special effects helped to further enforce that.

Yes, there were a few cheesy lines but it wasn't as bad as it was in Frank Miller's 300 (loved that movie anyway!).

Overall I think the CGI was well done. It blended well with the live action and didn't detract from any of the scenes, at least from what I remember. Nothing immediately shot out at me that made me think it was executed poorly. I'm willing to see this again in theaters. Any takers?

dyalander wrote:Also making Bumblebee a hot rod and the little bumblebee-like car some new Transformer character, and then not having Hot Rod in the movie makes no sense, and really bothered me.
As for Bumblebee being a Camaro instead of a VW, my brother noticed that most of the non-military tranformers were under the General Motors brand (Chevy, GMC, Hummer, and Pontiac). Perhaps licensing had a lot to do with those type of changes. My dad had a '79 Z28 Camaro which is why I didn't mind that particular change. Jazz being a freaking Pontiac Solstice bothered me a little, oddly enough. As for Hot Rod, I am unclear as to why he would be in this movie. He was not one of the original autobots in the cartoons and was introduced in the 1986 movie. He was a pretty major character after Prime, though. Maybe I'm missing something.
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Switch Kicker
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Post by Switch Kicker »

Can't wait for the sequel... They left the option open by having Starscream escape. See it again in theaters, I did, and I might be going again in the next few days, lol. I get in free half the time cause over half the people at the theater are friends. I only don't get in free when that fat lady (manager) is there... Oh well, lol.
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Post by Outsider »

I really had only very modest expectations for this movie, and yet it still seemed to disappoint even those. Lame.
dyalander wrote:but to me it's called "Transformers" not "Dickhead humans" I wanted a movie about transformers
That was certainly one major problem - the humans had all the good parts, and the Transformers were mostly just eye-candy in a movie about humans. The robots showed up relatively late in the film and barely had any personalities - all the Autobots seemed to be pretty simple stereotypes, and even then had very few lines. Optimus Prime had the most lines, but he's kind of stiff anyway. Bumblebee seemed to portray some personality, but didn't actually get to really speak till the end. Sam Whitwicki started out pretty annoying, though I grew to like him some by the end. The two main guys on the Special Forces team were pretty cool. But almost all the other humans... I actually thought that they were written and acted pretty well, but they were so completely pointless. They served no real role. That scene where they used the old radio to transmit something or other to the jets... was completedly meaningless and totally tacked-on just to give them something to do. None of that code-breaking stuff in the beginning, which seemed kind of cool and mysterious, actually amounted to anything meaningful either. The whole bit with Captain Whitwicki's glasses, that was all pretty lame and meaningless too, as the glasses where supposed to have encoded where the cube was, but the cube had been moved after all that happened anyway, and everybody actually found the cube without the aid of the glasses anyway. Actually, the Autobots were all headed towards the Dam after examining the glasses... and that didn't make any sense, since Megatron's navigation stuff was imprinted on the glasses BEFORE the cube was moved to the dam...
dyalander wrote:There were continuity errors
I figure that must be what you're talking about...
Dyalander wrote:constant camera movement
Yeah, I didn't like that style either. Compare it to the better fight scenes in the Matrix, like Neo's subway showdown with Agent Smith... the camera-work in The Matrix lets you actually observe all the cool moves they do while fighting. In Transformers frenetic style you can barely tell whats actually going on because the camera moves so much and focuses in too close alot. I hate that kind of fight-scene. Its like Batman Begins - Liam Neeson can't actually do a good fight scene, so they just had alot of fancy camera movements and focus the camera in much to close on one arm making a punch and another blocking it, and the result is you can barely actually see the fighting. Similar crap techniques were used in Daredevil, as Ben Afflect can't actually fight... but I can't even understand why they would need to do that in a movie where all the combatants are computer generated robots. It was just lame.

I didn't even really like the robots. As vehicles they were cool, and the transitions from robot to vehicle and back were okay, but as robots alot of them looked pretty much the same. I had trouble telling Megatron apart from Starscream when they were in robot form, and speaking of Megatron and Starscream: one of the things that was good about the original concept was that the characters all had unique and outsized personalities, and personality conflicts too, Megatron and Starscream being pretty much the best examples of that. And yet, in this movie, they displayed very little personality of any sort. Megatron wasn't even in the movie till near the end, and then had only a few lines. Starscream had far fewer than even Megatron's paltry lines. I think about the only thing he said at all was something like "I live to serve you, lord Megatron." He didn't fight with him or plot against him or anything.

A movie with heros NEEDS a good villain, and without it, well, it just sucks. Thats why "Star Trek 2: The Wrath of Khan" was the only really good Trek movie, because its the only one with a villain thats a good match, in terms of personality and acting, to the hero. Its like, imagine Star Wars if you took away almost all of Darth Vader and the emporer's lines, cut half their scenes, and made them look less interesting and about the same... Imagine "The Matrix" if Neo didn't have somebody as cool as Agent Smith to contend with. If you cut most of Smith's lines out, like the scene where he interrogates Morpheus, it just wouldn't be that great. Villains, man, gotta have good strong villains. Tranformers didn't pay enough attention to the villains.

The only characters in Transformers who really played the villian role were the Sector 7 guy, and that very small Decepticon. The Sector 7 guy was, like many of the other humans, mostly pointless, and the small robot was, well, I don't know, kind of cool, but also a little too silly, behaving all like a psychotic housepet or something.

I know I'm pretty hard to please, but its like they weren't even trying with this turky. I didn't have that much good to say about "300", but this makes "300" seem pretty good by comparison.

When was the last time there was a sci-fi or fantasy film that didn't disappoint? Its been several years at least. And in that time, television has actually been kicking the crap out of Hollywood on the sci-fi, fantasy, and intrigue fronts. Thats pretty pathetic of Hollywood, that they're being so badly outdone by t.v. I hope they figure that out and turn it around soon, but I won't hold my breath for it.
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Post by Switch Kicker »

Cube was never moved. Pay attention.
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Post by Blue_turnip »

Switch Kicker wrote:
Zeke wrote:Holy
Zeke wrote:Shit

that is to say that I thoroughly enjoyed this movie
You like it that much too?

God damn.. anyone else jizz a little when the weapon specialist robot did that front flip while dodging rockets? I know I did.

Movie makes me want to spend $6000 on a Boes home theater just for this one movie...

All of the scenes where a transformer went from robot to vehicle while moving was insane. I really liked the first one, when teh cop car bot dive forwards and just *mechanical noise* and he's a cop car flyin' down the street... A the fighter jet and helicopter ones... oh, so bad ass.

Easily my favorite movie of all time. I saw it twice within 12 hours of eachother. Wanna see it again too... :oops:

Oh, and you know Mountain Dew paid OUT THE ASS to be put in the film like that.
The only parts I where I jizzed was when Megan Fox got on screen.
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Post by Jeremy »

Outsider wrote: The whole bit with Captain Whitwicki's glasses, that was all pretty lame and meaningless too, as the glasses where supposed to have encoded where the cube was, but the cube had been moved after all that happened anyway, and everybody actually found the cube without the aid of the glasses anyway. Actually, the Autobots were all headed towards the Dam after examining the glasses... and that didn't make any sense, since Megatron's navigation stuff was imprinted on the glasses BEFORE the cube was moved to the dam...
You must have misunderstood the movie, because they clearly state when the cube appears in the movie that the dam was built around it. It wasn't ever moved at all.

I think you have to realise though, that the concept that the movie was based on was a very silly one to begin with. Why would super alien robots transform into relatively normal machines, and if they did, why not ones that can fly really fast? I am fairly sure it's impossible to craft a serious and "realistic" movie around such a silly idea. So the only way the film makers could have made an enjoyable movie, was either going with animation, or no semblance with reality, or accepting that it's a silly concept, and making an intentionally silly movie. They went with the latter, and the majority of reviews show that they succeed. You have to accept that it's a silly film.
When was the last time there was a sci-fi or fantasy film that didn't disappoint? Its been several years at least.
Children Of Men - December 2006 (US release)

Pan's Labyrinth - December 2006 (US release)

Next - April 2007

So to answer your question, about 3 months.
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Post by Outsider »

Jeremy wrote:Why would super alien robots transform into relatively normal machines, and if they did, why not ones that can fly really fast?
'Cause they're "robots in disguise", duh. And if you're wearing a disguise, a car is alot less conspicuous than a high-tech jet fighter.
You must have misunderstood the movie
Nu-uh! Okay, well, maybe a little. It still doesn't excuse the fact that the movie is focused too much on humans and not enough on the robots, and that too many of the humans' roles go nowhere, that the lead villains don't have enough lines, don't really look all that cool, and that the fight scenes are filmed in an annoyingly frantic manner, presumably to cover up for the director and producers' unwillingness or inability to actually choreograph a good fight scene.
So the only way the film makers could have made an enjoyable movie, was either going with animation, or no semblance with reality, or accepting that it's a silly concept, and making an intentionally silly movie.
Oh, if only. I love a good animated film, and I'd take an Otomo or Miyazaki over Michael Bay any day of the week. And technically, alot of the movie IS still animated, just in a style that is meant to look realistic instead of drawn and painted.

And speaking of Miyazaki, his son's first big debut film, an adaptation of LeGuin's Wizard of Earthsea, is due out soon, I think. I'm not really all that psyched, since I think "A Wizard of Earthsea" is a little over-rated in the fantasy genre, but, as I said, I love a good animated feature film, and Miyazaki Sr. is the king, so I'm eager to see if the prince can fill his crown.
Children Of Men - December 2006 (US release)
Pan's Labyrinth - December 2006 (US release)
Next - April 2007
Those WERE good, true, but not exactly what I had in mind. I was thinking about a good exciting sci-fi or fantasy actioner, like The Matrix or LoTR. There certainly were some pretty hairy fight scenes in Children of Men, but over-all it wasn't really about the action. Man, that movie really scared me, though, with its depiction of what we take to be a very stable society just coming apart at the seams with a runaway refugee problem, a represive military and an armed resistance to it, and terrorist attacks on cafes. I left that movie with chills and an uncomfortable sense of dread. I loved those scenes towards the end that were just charged with religious symbolism, like, a biblical story actually happening, and in modern times... that pause in the fight as they left the run-down tenament, and then the journey in the rowboat starting out in that "cave". Cool stuff.
I'm not gonna go into Pan's right now... thats already got its own thread.

But what is "Next" ? I don't think I've heard of that.
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Post by james »

Megatron had personality. That is one badass motherfucker.

Funnily enough the corny lines did not phase me at all with this film. Which is extremely rare.
It was made to be silly, and it works.


My only complaint is jazz getting the axe, cuz he's cool and I thought he was supposed to be one of the better fighters. His death was just too abrupt.
But that line is cool though 'no, I want two'.
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Post by Jeremy »

Next is a sci-fi movie staring Nicholas Cage, based on a book by Philip K Dick. I probably shouldn't have included it on the list, because it's a pretty bad movie, apart from the fact that it's perfectly in the spirit of PKDs work. If you're a fan of PKD, you'll love this movie. If not, you'll probably think I'm mental.
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Post by mtoolan »

i personally thought this movie was great.
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Post by sanuke okumatzu »

james wrote:My only complaint is jazz getting the axe, cuz he's cool and I thought he was supposed to be one of the better fighters. His death was just too abrupt.
But that line is cool though 'no, I want two'.
Jeez way to ruin it :roll:


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Post by Bringerofpie »

james wrote:Megatron had personality. That is one badass motherfucker.
But you do Not. Fuck. With. Optimus.

Also, Megan Fox...super hot.
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Post by dyalander »

accepting that it's a silly concept, and making an intentionally silly movie
I'd be careful attributing this intention to Micheal Bay. There's a good chance he's taken it seriously. Indeed in the interviews I've read he taken it seriously and expressed the intent to make it as coherent as possible - for example, not wanting large robots to turn into small objects and vica versa because it wouldn't make sense.
I don't think the movie was intentionally silly throughout and tried, at times, to be seriously dramatic, and failed. When that happens there is a fine line between funny and just crap. At some moments it was really funny, but others were just crap and cliche.
I think the film's fundamental intention is commercial and so by those measures it will more than likely be a success and sell lots of toys for Hasbro, and cars for GM.
Regardless, even if you take out the notion of film-maker intentions, I felt that base line levels of coherence were not achieved and more importantly that the film would have been better if they were. So its not that the movie was silly, but that it could have been so much better (even though the better version in my head is still pretty silly. At least it would better manage the balance between suspension of disbelief, responsibility to original source material, and the need for some emblems of coherence)
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Post by Frank_Sinatra »

This movie sucked it hard.

There were some really good action scenes, the first action sequence was great and I was just ready to kick back and soak up the awesomeness. But then after that first sequence it just drags for like half an hour or more, and doesn't really recover. I didn't like the human characters, and I thought most of the subplots could have been eliminated without harming the movie at all. Seemed like the writers had a hard enough time keeping the plot coherent, maybe fewer characters would have helped them keep track...

The "analysts" could have been eliminated entirely, because they didn't really do shit in the entire movie.

Whitwicki was fucking annoying. His family was worse. And all the Flash Gordon/Peter Parker bullshit with the girl's boyfriend was so lame. Whitwicki's best friend was lame. The girl was shallow & lame & I couldn't figure out why I should care if the stuttering douchebag hooked up with her or not.

I don't think the scenes focusing on the human characters had to be so bad, but they were all written as stupid assholes. I was totally rooting for the decepticons to kill them all.

Huge plot incoherence. I don't care if your movie is about robots, aliens, talking houseplants, whatever. If you introduce a certain rule or logic, you have to follow it. Some of the things in this movie are directly contradictory to the immediately preceeding scene, so I just couldn't care what happened. Its like if Lord of the Rings had ended with Frodo being able to crush the ring with a hammer, even though a previous scene had shown that couldn't work. You'd just think "why the fuck did I watch ten hours of elves and dwarves walking around New Zealand?"

Spoiler: Here's a for instance. In one scene, the Transformers confront Sector 7, and the stuttering douchebag Whitwicki gets away. In the next scene, Sector 7 catches up to Whitwicki, and the Transformers all hide from Sector 7 and let Bumblebee get captured? That's basically the entire movie... "why the fuck did that last scene even happen if they're just gonna do this?"


Well, those are my main complaints. There's other stuff that bugged me but I won't get into it, mostly I don't want to spoil those scenes for anyone.

The special effects & art were great, though. Just wanted more of that & a lot less of the humans, especially since the humans were hard for me to like, a lot of them had no need to be in the movie, and so many of their scenes were just filler that ended up not mattering at all.
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Post by Matt K »

Apparently Transformers is the most original movie of the year. I have not seen the movie yet, but I totally disagree with that.
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Post by Jeremy »

Matt K wrote:Apparently Transformers is the most original movie of the year. I have not seen the movie yet, but I totally disagree with that.
That's a great opinion...

I heard that Citizen Kane is the greatest movie ever. I haven't seen it, but I'm sure Transformers is better <_<
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Post by Colin »

I saw this yesterday and one member of the group would roll their eyes at the terrible bits almost loud enough to keep me from enjoying it. Christ, who goes to a movie like this without being prepared to absorb these kinds of flaws gracefully?

Spoiler: And Nathan, that happened because it's easy to intimidate seven (or whatever number) guys in suits to back off without killing them, while the choppers ect were there for a fight that the Transformers wanted no part of. Not that the movie wasn't full of contradictions, I just don't think that was one of them.
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Post by Frank_Sinatra »

I'm not entirely convinced by that explanation, but at least its some kind of explanation.

I don't see why the prerequisite for seeing an action movie has to be turning your brain off. I know a lot of people go to these movies and just turn off the more critical parts of their thinking, guess I can't do that.

Knowing who the director was, and figuring this was just another license for Hollywood to cash in on, I wasn't expecting too much going into the movie. I figured there would be some good special effects, giant robots, some nostalgia for the cartoon, and lots of action. After the first sequence I was thinking it would be all of that, but from about the 11th minute through the 45th minute my ability to forgive the stupidity & inconsistencies wore thinner and thinner.

They could have at least shown us the fight between Barricade & Bumblebee.
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Post by Colin »

I don't care whether someone turns off his brain (although I recommend it), but it's only polite to turn off your mouth and refrain from 'what the fuck' gestures until exiting the theater.
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Post by Matt K »

I disagree that it's the most original movie of the year because it's based off of an existing franchise, therefore, not original.
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