Stitching thread

[HippieTom]

well the time gained with the not tying knots thing is my only real incentive for using floss, its not so much about the actual speed just whether or not its worth switching from my already stable oudoor upolstery thread to floss, floss having the speed advantage if you dont tye knots thats all haha

[Jordan]

floss is better...


was that what you were looking for?

[zeroman13]

I'm sorry, but I disagree! Some of the bags that I've gotten that were floss, were ok. But not all of them. All the bags that I've gotten, and made, that were with upholstery thread felt amazing!

I think upholstery thread helps the bag keep it's roundness better than floss. But that's me.

Upholstery thread FTW!!!

[shredzilla]

This reminds me of a story my great-great-great-great grandfather once told me while we were sitting by the fire, and I was just a wee lad, back in the '20s...

Goldieshred and the Three Bags

One day, Goldieshred was walking along and came to this wide open shred spot, perfectly flat and great for shredding. While he was there, he saw three bags. And decided to try them out. The first one was made of floss.

"This bag is too wiry!" said Goldieshred. The next one was made of upholstery thread.

"This bag is too springy!" said Goldieshred. The last one was made from button thread. As soon as he picked it up, he realized how easily the thread flowed with the bag. It was floppy, yet responsive, rounded nicely with each set, and collapsed gently with each catch.

"This bag is JUUUUST right!" said Goldieshred. He then hit backside alpine gyro nemesis swirling rake with that special bag, and from then on, Goldieshred and the 3 bags lived happily ever after.

THE END

[HippieTom]

that story is great haha maybe i will try floss but as it is i am happy with the performance of upholstery thread but i really like the story so i think ill try button thread when i run out of upholstery thread or maybe sooner

Goldieshred haha

[Jordan]

Goldieshred<3

[Wasabi]

Technique > equipment (in this case, thread), just like in footbag play.

I can make an awesome bag with floss, thread, or whatever. As long as you can make a reliable anchor and end knot, that's all that matters in terms of a good foundation, so that the area in question doesn't bust open.

Also, in my experience, one knot for floss is a good enough stopper from over-melting the floss end. This is in terms of single-threading your bags. If you have a good eye, you don't ever need to knot and can just burn from the size of the black bulb you want/need.

[shredzilla]

Technique > equipment (in this case, thread), just like in footbag play.

Incorrect. By that logic a basketball made of stone would be equal to one made of rubber as long as they were both crafted with care. I'm not saying one is in FACT better than the other in terms of floss and thread, but that's my opinion. If I prefer the way thread plays, how could your technique be superior to my preference? They're not mutually exclusive to one another, it's two separate points.

[Jordan]

im sorry to ask this...

but why is everyone such a smart ass?

[shredzilla]

Because this is the internet kid, get used to it

[Jordan]

i wish i didnt have to.

[King Monkey]

Ive found that when melting the ends of floss, once the bag has been completed and filled, the melted parts have a tendency to come apart. Ive found this when ive had to open a just-finished bag because of some screw up i have to fix.
So i always tie off on every completed pent then melt the ends, because im concerned the melts will break and the panels will blow out.

Has anyone else found this?

[mosher]

It's all in how you do them.

You can't just melt two pieces together in replace of a knot and expect it to hold!

The melt can't be load bearing in the same way that a knot can, you have to figure out a way to take the forces off the melt so that it is just a seal to the deal.

I do this by looping through the last hole once to make an anchor of sorts.

[King Monkey]

Sorry, i didnt make myself quite clear in my post.

Ive never done the melt-only technique; i always knot after each pent and then melt the two ends of that piece of floss together for some kind of extra hold. However these ends, which dont have any load on them because the floss is already knotted, still break apart. Is it my floss brand?

[Jordan]

I know my double knotting and then burning technique might be a little too much, but Im kinda paranoid about my knots popping, so I feel like the extra knot and melt keeps it as secure as possible.

[Wasabi]

Incorrect. By that logic a basketball made of stone would be equal to one made of rubber as long as they were both crafted with care. I'm not saying one is in FACT better than the other in terms of floss and thread, but that's my opinion. If I prefer the way thread plays, how could your technique be superior to my preference? They're not mutually exclusive to one another, it's two separate points.

Chris, I hope you understand that this point you made was pretty stupid. I'd like to see you make a stone ball bounce with the same density as one made with rubber. And who would even play with a stone ball in any sport that requires bouncing it? Also, the technique to craft a spherical stone, ie. chiseling and sanding, is completely different than molding a basketball.

And there is a whole variety of shoes that people wear for footbag for equipment. It doesn't have to be restricted to Rod Lavers, G-units, Quantums or Climacools. Some people like to play in Nastases, some people with Tejas sandals, and a lot of other people finding great finds that could replace the gold standards for footwear. And I'm not even talking about equipment in terms of footwear, but the equipment you use for sewing bags.

The process of sewing a 32-panel footbag, or any footbag in general is the same: attach one panel to another with needle and thread.

I'm just saying that whatever equipment you make a footbag with, as long as your technique in making that footbag is refined and articulated, it will play well and break in well.

[shredzilla]

Well you didn't articulate your point as such. You said (your) technique>equipment. Implying that your stitching supersedes the materials it's made of, which is simply incorrect. I've already made this point in the previous post, this is a complete rehash of that post. If you think that point is 'stupid', then that's your prerogative.

Do you make good bags that break in well? Yes. Does your stitching superiority have a direct effect on how two different substances react? No, the materials themselves do. If I notice subtle nuances in the way a bag plays that contains certain materials, no matter how well you stitch it, you can't imitate the properties of those materials using other materials. It's a pretty obvious observation really, which is why I used the stone and rubber ball example. The fact you still haven't grasped the point is kinda silly and I think you're just being argumentative at this point.

To put it in footbag-related terms, if you filled one bag with metal, and the other with all rubber, would both bags play "well" do to your stitching talent? Perhaps, but the term "well" is arbitrary and doesn't take into consideration the vast preferences of players other than yourself. Since I do not like how rubber-filled bags play, I would say "no", the bag with metal plays better. So your stitching technique played no part in my liking of the bag or not, and did not supersede the materials it was composed of, thus making the statement:

technique(stitching)>equipment(composite materials), false. Good day.

[Wasabi]

Technique > equipment (in this case, thread), just like in footbag play.

I can make an awesome bag with floss, thread, or whatever. As long as you can make a reliable anchor and end knot, that's all that matters in terms of a good foundation, so that the area in question doesn't bust open.

Also, in my experience, one knot for floss is a good enough stopper from over-melting the floss end. This is in terms of single-threading your bags. If you have a good eye, you don't ever need to knot and can just burn from the size of the black bulb you want/need.

I'm looking at my previous statement here, and I don't see anything wrong with it, nor am I inciting that my technique is superior to any one person or anybody that sews in this forum or outside in the irl footbag community.

Here's the low-down on the post, Chris, which I think you obviously missed:

Technique > equipment (in this case, thread), just like in footbag play.

This is a general statement. There is nothing here that leads anyone to think that I have a superior technique in sewing.

I can make an awesome bag with floss, thread, or whatever. As long as you can make a reliable anchor and end knot, that's all that matters in terms of a good foundation, so that the area in question doesn't bust open.

I made the statement here that I CAN make awesome bags with whatever equipment is given to me. However, I immediately supported it with what I think is a tendency that makes good bags go bad: busted stitches. No matter what equipment you use to sew, unless you have a good foundation and knot on how you seal up your seams efficiently, they will bust open. I've played and seen a lot of great bags bust open quite frequently, and I'm always the one that has to go and re-sew panels together due to the ineffeciency of the knotting of some stitchers. That's why I think it's important, in my observation, for people to take a good look in their stitching technique and see if there are any parts in their sewing path that *might* make the seams bust open and destroy that very foundation they built up (stitching and gathering). This is where "technique > equipment," where you can use whatever thread you have and still push out an awesome footbag with the right technique.

However, if you make a reliable knot regardless of an anchor, that works as well, just as long as you make a reliable knot that connects where you began with where you end. Making the statements of an "anchor" and "knot" explains what I mean already: where you begin and where you end in your sewing path.

I only made the statement that I make awesome bags, and I do, but I did not incite that my technique is in any way superior.

You said (your) technique>equipment. Implying that your stitching supersedes the materials it's made of, which is simply incorrect.

This is your assumption. You misread my post.

As for the rest of your post, you're talking smack, and is irrelevant to the topic's main idea and purpose.

edit: Also, if you're explaining to me in terms of materials, such as fabrics and fillers, that is a completely different discussion, with different variables for different types of instances, such as the use of ultrasuede soft for 12-panels and such. As for fillers, people can get creative. I know you don't like rubber in your bags, but a good footbagger doesn't complain about small nuances as having "a small bit of rubber" affecting their performance with a footbag. At least I don't see it, but I'm fine with it regardless.

[shredzilla]

Technique > equipment (in this case, thread), just like in footbag play.

LOL!!! That is the only thing in any of your post I disputed. I said that is an incorrect statement, and I still stand by that. It has nothing to do with if you can make a good bag out of thread, floss, upholstery, deer sinew, fishing line, anything. Your stitching superiority is irrelevant I guess, I only included that because it was the preface to that quote. You said you can make a good bag out of anything, I guess I inadvertently touched on that, but that's a complete tangent.

You made a general statement that is simply false. Stitching technique is not superior to the materials you use if said materials are undesirable to other people. Nor is the statement:

equipment (in this case, thread) > technique, true either. As I mentioned, they are separate points, independent from one another. I'm sure by now you have to agree on my point that the general statement is false.

Even if Anz can shred in combat boots, it doesn't mean he can bust 10 fearless in combat boots. Hell maybe he can, but you don't think he's putting forth any more effort at all? It's because the shoe isn't made from the same materials that he is accustomed to or preferential toward.

[Wasabi]

*facepalm*

I quit.