A. How do you know you can play at the same level?
B. If you Are going to argue that you can play at the same level why post a question.
Why Lavers??
And so do i, but i still do it in Lavers. In fact, if you surveyed this forum, youd find that most people hereMagus86 wrote:I do this for fun, not to be good or the best or whatever.
a) play for fun and
b) play for fun in lavers.
We certainly dont do it for the international fame, money, and all the other trimmings that brings with it.
If your happy with your shoes, and your happy with how they kick, and you can do switches or mirages in them, then good on you. Youve got into the true spirit of the sport and thats fantastic. If you feel that buying the recommended footwear is not for you, thats cool also. The simple fact is this : If you were looking to buy a commercial, off the shelf shoe for footbag, you should buy Rod Lavers. You dont HAVE to... its still your choice... but thats the reccommendation.
The responses you have and will most likely recieve here though represent many, MANY years worth of experience, experience that you feel you have the ability to question, and thats starting to make you seem arrogant.
Footbag players swear by Lavers because they have excellent stalling surfaces and they are light-weight. Modifications aren't necessary. I would actually recommend playing in them without mods for a while before you make a decision either way. Some of the best players in the world don't mod their Lavers whatsoever. Unmodded Lavers are advantageous over skate shoes in every way.
Playing in your skate shoes is fine if that's all you want to do.
If you try doing tricks much more difficult than your basic kicks and stalls though, you're also a lot more likely to hurt yourself. Skate shoes are a lot heavier than tennis/footbag shoes. It may not sound like a big difference when you're talking in grams, but if you plan to play even casually for more than a couple of years, your knees will notice. Hurting yourself from playing footbag may also sound laughable, but again that is where it is advantageous to heed the advice of those with years of experience.
You don't need Lavers if you don't plan to learn freestyle tricks.
Playing in your skate shoes is fine if that's all you want to do.
If you try doing tricks much more difficult than your basic kicks and stalls though, you're also a lot more likely to hurt yourself. Skate shoes are a lot heavier than tennis/footbag shoes. It may not sound like a big difference when you're talking in grams, but if you plan to play even casually for more than a couple of years, your knees will notice. Hurting yourself from playing footbag may also sound laughable, but again that is where it is advantageous to heed the advice of those with years of experience.
You don't need Lavers if you don't plan to learn freestyle tricks.
Have you ever even bothered to look at that enormous blob of writing that is the rules of footbag? It's on footbag.org. We aren't just a bunch of losers kicking a miniature soccer ball around. We don't make up all the rules. There are rules of footbag. While much of them we hardly ever think of, there are rules.Magus86 wrote:
The only difference here is that footbag isn't some big competitive sport that a ton of people care about with all kinds of rules and regulations.
In a way, people do care. For some reason, if there aren't any players around, they will play. There is some kind of "deep" caring about keeping footbag alive. If the world of footbag crumbles, people will care. They don't play because some other people do it, keeping the sport alive. If the players now stop, more will come.
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PoisonTaffy
- Egyptian Footgod
- Posts: 1003
- Joined: 23 Jun 2007 15:42
- Location: Israel, center
- Contact:
If you're not willing to learn from other people's experience (you asked a question, got a unanimous answer from dozens of people who tried skater shoes and freestyle shoes, and you still argue even though you've only tried skater shoes),
the only other thing you can do is to get some of your own experience, either by buying or making an effort to have a session with a freestyle player who owns freestyle shoes (practically every freestyle player owns freestyle shoes), and then come back and continue the discussion. I suggest the latter, if possible. It's a real eye opener, in a very positive sense.
Otherwise, you've made your point and so did everyone else and further discussion is pointless.
the only other thing you can do is to get some of your own experience, either by buying or making an effort to have a session with a freestyle player who owns freestyle shoes (practically every freestyle player owns freestyle shoes), and then come back and continue the discussion. I suggest the latter, if possible. It's a real eye opener, in a very positive sense.
Otherwise, you've made your point and so did everyone else and further discussion is pointless.
"Childhood is short, immaturity is forever"
Roy Klein
Roy Klein
Jesus christ, people are touchy, take shit way too seriously, and misinterpret things way too much...
1. I never said I was as good as any pro. I said I don't care if I am or not. All I can do is a few basic kicks and stalls. I was simply asking what's with all the hype about lavers. I don't know why everybody's taking this as some sort of attack and coming to bitch at me. I asked a question because I didn't understand something. For some reason, apparently it's a bad thing, and so is being skeptical...
2. In my remark about not a ton of people caring about footbag, I was referring to the fact that it doesn't seem to be as popular as baseball, basketball, football, etc. At least not in America, and if it is, I can't tell. It's a hell of a lot easier to go to a store and find a basketball, baseball, tennis ball, football, soccer ball, golf ball, even a damn croquet set than it is to find a footbag. If I want one, I have to go to a head shop or skateboard/bmx/"xtreme sport" store, and the best I find are crocheted bags and maybe a Jester. Perhaps I'm totally wrong, but in my observation, most people just kick the footbag around and keep it in the air, sometimes doing tricks. Most don't go to competitions or argue about what tricks are called. They just do it for fun, in groups(probably at least 50% of the time after smoking pot) or alone. It's generally a hobby. This is what I have observed in my neck of the woods. I didn't say you were a bunch of losers kicking a mini soccer ball around. If I had no interest in or didn't like footbag myself, I wouldn't be here... I make my own bags, for christ's sake. Why would I think you're losers for playing a game I like to play too??
In any case, I wouldn't buy any pair of shoes until I tried them first, just like I wouldn't buy a car without test driving it. That, and footbag isn't important enough to me to go buy a pair of shoes just for playing it anyway. Maybe someday, but not today, and not anytime soon, if ever(most likely not). By the way, just so you all know, my neck of the woods is mostly filled with amish people, rednecks, farmers, and old people. Footbag isn't generally all that popular with them, or at least not the ones around here.
1. I never said I was as good as any pro. I said I don't care if I am or not. All I can do is a few basic kicks and stalls. I was simply asking what's with all the hype about lavers. I don't know why everybody's taking this as some sort of attack and coming to bitch at me. I asked a question because I didn't understand something. For some reason, apparently it's a bad thing, and so is being skeptical...
2. In my remark about not a ton of people caring about footbag, I was referring to the fact that it doesn't seem to be as popular as baseball, basketball, football, etc. At least not in America, and if it is, I can't tell. It's a hell of a lot easier to go to a store and find a basketball, baseball, tennis ball, football, soccer ball, golf ball, even a damn croquet set than it is to find a footbag. If I want one, I have to go to a head shop or skateboard/bmx/"xtreme sport" store, and the best I find are crocheted bags and maybe a Jester. Perhaps I'm totally wrong, but in my observation, most people just kick the footbag around and keep it in the air, sometimes doing tricks. Most don't go to competitions or argue about what tricks are called. They just do it for fun, in groups(probably at least 50% of the time after smoking pot) or alone. It's generally a hobby. This is what I have observed in my neck of the woods. I didn't say you were a bunch of losers kicking a mini soccer ball around. If I had no interest in or didn't like footbag myself, I wouldn't be here... I make my own bags, for christ's sake. Why would I think you're losers for playing a game I like to play too??
In any case, I wouldn't buy any pair of shoes until I tried them first, just like I wouldn't buy a car without test driving it. That, and footbag isn't important enough to me to go buy a pair of shoes just for playing it anyway. Maybe someday, but not today, and not anytime soon, if ever(most likely not). By the way, just so you all know, my neck of the woods is mostly filled with amish people, rednecks, farmers, and old people. Footbag isn't generally all that popular with them, or at least not the ones around here.
Last edited by Magus86 on 12 Jul 2010 20:18, edited 1 time in total.
perhaps everyone is just trying to help, and youre the one taking it as a personal attack or a serious bombardment of opinions. Some of the guys on this forum really, really know what theyre talking about, and from skimming through the replies to your "question", they all have solid feedback; its all preference. And if youre going to get upset with this, than you shouldnt of posted the question in the first place. You should of read around the forum a bit, or even went to a local adidas outlet or sports store and tried on a pair of lavers yourself. The search option on the forum helps too. take care.
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Frank_Sinatra
- Avenging Disco Godfather
- Posts: 1660
- Joined: 09 Jan 2007 12:43
- Location: Chicago, IL
Its all pretty simple dude. Due to their light weight and thin, broad, flat surfaces, lavers don't interfere with controlling the bag as much as other shoes (including skate shoes). People play in lavers because they want to get better at footbag. And obviously this forum is used by a community of people who want to improve at footbag.
Everything that can be said beyond that is just a pissing match, which you can choose to participate in or not to participate in.
Everything that can be said beyond that is just a pissing match, which you can choose to participate in or not to participate in.
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F[uns]tylin' Eclectic
- Post Master General
- Posts: 4092
- Joined: 05 Feb 2010 19:53
- Location: Drumore, PA
I just private messaged Magus, because my friends and I are getting together near Reading and having a shred session, and Magus lives right in the same town as Zach Hoffa, who might possibly be coming, so Magus, If you do decide to come shred with us, we'll all show you, by example, why it's good to have freestyle shoes. Some dudes won't even take you seriously as a freestyler if you DON'T have freestyle shoes in some way or another.PoisonTaffy wrote:
the only other thing you can do is to get some of your own experience, either by buying or making an effort to have a session with a freestyle player who owns freestyle shoes (practically every freestyle player owns freestyle shoes), and then come back and continue the discussion. I suggest the latter, if possible. It's a real eye opener, in a very positive sense.
Plus, I feel it makes shoes bag-friendly and it's just cool to customize your own shoes that no one else in the entire world has the exact same pair of. I read on the forum somewhere that "playing footbag is like being a jedi and making your own light-saber" or something along those lines. You KNOW you wanna become a jedi.... don't even pretend you don't... BECAUSE YOU DO. In all seriousness, definitely come shred with us this weekend. We'll be able to show you a thing or two.
Welcome to the (online) freestyle footbag scene! Enjoy your stay.Magus86 wrote:Jesus christ, people are touchy, take shit way too seriously, and misinterpret things way too much...
Don't wear lavers. These people are all fucking with you trying to make you look stupid. Everyone knows the the Monty Wards are the way to go for hacky sack. Vans are tight as shit for freestyle. I learned with them and now I use DVS shoes.
Ummm... no? Stop talking out yer ass so much there guy.Sick*Nick*Slick*Kick wrote:Some dudes won't even take you seriously as a freestyler if you DON'T have freestyle shoes in some way or another.
James Randall
I wear vans because they're comfortable, not because I think they're good for footbag, but they work better than any other shoe I've tried kicking with. I don't care enough about footbag to buy shoes just to play it. How about instead of trying to make fun of me for shit I never even said, you say something possibly constructive or helpful? Wait, no, that won't happen. I forgot, the forum snobs get off on this shit. Since some people around here have the reading comprehension of a 10 year old, allow me to explain something: When someone says "I can play just fine in my skater shoes," it means that he is happy with his ability to play in those shoes. It does NOT mean that he thinks he's as good as everybody else. If you can't figure that out, you need to go back to school.habitat wrote:Welcome to the (online) freestyle footbag scene! Enjoy your stay.Magus86 wrote:Jesus christ, people are touchy, take shit way too seriously, and misinterpret things way too much...
Don't wear lavers. These people are all fucking with you trying to make you look stupid. Everyone knows the the Monty Wards are the way to go for hacky sack. Vans are tight as shit for freestyle. I learned with them and now I use DVS shoes.
Ummm... no? Stop talking out yer ass so much there guy.Sick*Nick*Slick*Kick wrote:Some dudes won't even take you seriously as a freestyler if you DON'T have freestyle shoes in some way or another.
Slick Nick, no, I don't want to be a Jedi. I've never liked star wars. Bad choice of analogy... However, that's not the point. It doesn't matter even if the shoes would make me better at footbag because there's another limiting factor that the shoes have nothing to do with. I'm too fat and inflexible to do most of the things I've seen anyway. And besides that, I'm perfectly fine with not being taken seriously as a freestyler because I'm not taking it seriously myself, and I never claimed to be a freestyler. I'm just some guy who likes to make and kick footbags.
This is the issue right here I think. What your playing may well be footbag, but I dont believe its freestyle. You sound as though your circle kicking, old skool hacky sack style, and so yes your vans are perfect, just as the next guys Doc Martens might also be perfect. If however you wanted to progress from "hacking" into "footbag" (and please dont jump up and say "I dont blah blah" again, I get it) which is the term used in your original post....Magus86 wrote:I don't care enough about footbag to buy shoes just to play it.
.... then the advice is to buy Lavers.Why is it that everyone swears by Rod Lavers? What's so special about them that make them good for footbag, and why, if they're so good for footbag in the first place, do they need to be modified?
Please stop refering to members of this forum as "having the reading comprehension of a ten year old" or "elitist snobs" as well, its just unessecary and rude, especially as this may have been a case of crossed wires.
I never said I was playing freestyle in the first place. But it doesn't count as circle kicking unless there's other people around to actually have a circle of some kind.WyrmFyre wrote: Please stop refering to members of this forum as "having the reading comprehension of a ten year old" or "elitist snobs" as well, its just unessecary and rude, especially as this may have been a case of crossed wires.
Unnecessary and rude... Yes it is... but so is trying to make an ass out of me simply because I don't take the game as seriously as others or because I'm happy with how well I can play the game without buying special shoes. And putting words in my mouth is unnecessary and rude as well. I'm not calling everybody here a forum snob or saying that everybody here has shitty reading comprehension, but obviously some of you are and some of you do.
First of all, i know how a circle is made 
I use the term Circle Kicking (or Circle Kicker, or just Kicker) to describe one or more people who hack. Entry level footbag if you like, the very very core idea of the sport, which is to keep the bag off the ground. You have to remember that the term Footbag doesnt describe all its disciplines. Theres Freestyle Footbag and Footbag Net as an example. It seems to me that when you started this thread using the term footbag, I, and maybe others, presumed you meant freestyle.
Im not trying to make an ass out of you, nor am I putting words in your mouth. I said "please dont refer to members of this forum" but I didnt say you had called us all 10 year olds. Eitherway, just because you meant "a few people" and not "everyone" doesnt make it any less offensive.
I dont think your an ass for not taking it seriously either, and im happy too that you have found a level of play from footbag that you can enjoy. If i have made you feel or seem like an ass, then I am sorry, i did not set out with that intention.
Truce?
Edit : Incidentally....
.
I use the term Circle Kicking (or Circle Kicker, or just Kicker) to describe one or more people who hack. Entry level footbag if you like, the very very core idea of the sport, which is to keep the bag off the ground. You have to remember that the term Footbag doesnt describe all its disciplines. Theres Freestyle Footbag and Footbag Net as an example. It seems to me that when you started this thread using the term footbag, I, and maybe others, presumed you meant freestyle.
Im not trying to make an ass out of you, nor am I putting words in your mouth. I said "please dont refer to members of this forum" but I didnt say you had called us all 10 year olds. Eitherway, just because you meant "a few people" and not "everyone" doesnt make it any less offensive.
I dont think your an ass for not taking it seriously either, and im happy too that you have found a level of play from footbag that you can enjoy. If i have made you feel or seem like an ass, then I am sorry, i did not set out with that intention.
Truce?
Edit : Incidentally....
12 months ago I thought the same. I couldnt percieve of doing ATWs or legovers, and I thought that anyone on youtube who ha a video or them doing whirl was a god. Nowadays I practice tricks like Ripwalk (still not hit it), and not only can I whirl, but for fun, ive been trying pixie whirls Just saying, if i can do it....I'm too fat and inflexible to do most of the things I've seen anyway.
.No, Wyrmfyre, YOU did not make an ass out of me or put words in my mouth. I was not referring to you at all in any of that. Just to give you an idea of who I am/how I'm built, though, go to google image search and type "nintendo kid," and look at the 2nd picture that shows up. I swear to god, that is me, and if you don't believe me, I can prove it. That's like 6 years old, and I've lost a little bit of weight since then, but there isn't a huge difference.
what I said was snobbish? lol Did you read what I said? I actually do play with DVS shoes.
Just for the fact you have claimed "I never said ...." almost 20 times in this thread for things you said word for word, you win as the best modified troll of 2010. You have managed to take everything as a personal attack like a little baby dick and you have refused to listen to everyone who has attempted to honestly and dishonestly help you. Congrats. Now lose some weight.
Just for the fact you have claimed "I never said ...." almost 20 times in this thread for things you said word for word, you win as the best modified troll of 2010. You have managed to take everything as a personal attack like a little baby dick and you have refused to listen to everyone who has attempted to honestly and dishonestly help you. Congrats. Now lose some weight.
James Randall
No, actually I haven't done that, I'm not trolling, and sorry, but I read your post as sarcastic. Apparently I've made a mistake, and for that I apologize.
Last edited by Magus86 on 14 Jul 2010 12:39, edited 1 time in total.