Supporting Sweat Shops

[Seath]

I was a little angered by usernames response to Phil's option to not support Addidas because of their use of sweat shops:

well, no, tell him to go have a good long cry about it and when hes all out of tears buy lavers, or find some in the uk, i dont know any.

im the guy ryan's talking about

so yeah, my priorities? while im liking footbag thus far and want to get better, it doesnt take precedence over my morals

ebay seems like a good choice though, especially if i can score some second hand ones

and, for the record, the only shit i wear that was made in sweatshops is the crap i buy at thrift stores, which is not supporting sweatshops at all

its very possible to be a caring consumer
and sometimes, when it doesnt seem possible, there are ways to minimize the negative impacts that our consumerist habits have on others

think about it

yea and because you not buying the shoes is making a HUGE difference, look, thats how it works over there, they do it day in and day out, they have a sense of pride in the work they do, much more so than in americans, they dont take things for granite, and they still make it, not with much, but they make it. We're America, with a capital A, we are the main focus here, the big guy, and when we need things we speak up, and people do it. Im willing to bet that those workers who are making the shoes didnt flock to the job offer but they know that they can make enough money at that place of work to take care of their most basic needs and maybe some more if their lucky. It's just another way of life, maybe its not as flashy as an American's, but that the way they do it.

I think phil should be commended for his ability to place his morals above everything else and not feel obliged to change his way of thinking to better suit his lifestyle. You're talking to him like he's a brain-dead idiot, and I can tell you he's not at all. He's very intelligent and aware of world issues and has made an educated decision to not support companies that produce their merchandise in sub-par locations to save a buck and you are ripping into him! If you don't agree then just don't say anything but he definitely does not deserve this from a fellow footbagger. This community is suppose to welcome others not lash out at them for sticking to their beliefs. And it's not like he's not playing footbag just because lavers are made in China so give him a break for fucks sake.

And you have it all wrong, he doesn't want to support them because they abuse the fact that Addidas can pay well below what the labour is worth to people in China to make maximum dollar off their product, not to keep those damn chineese from working.

[Jeremy]

Yeah I agree Seath

You can only be responsible for your own actions. Obviously not buying sweat shop items is not enough to stop sweat shops - but it does mean that you aren't helping them to be profitable (for the owners) and already it's obvious that Phil has done more than just not buy from sweat shops - he's made an issue of it - and because it's getting more publicity on this site - hopefully more people will understand and follow suit.

In many cases the final price of the product sells for much more than the person would make in the whole year - yet they make many more than one pairs of shoes in one year. By paying such low rates the companies are keeping the area poor and giving it no chance to develope.

The newly elected Australian Liberal Party gives $224,000,000 to Papua New Guinea - of which about $160,000,000 goes to supporting companies that use sweat shops so that they can continue to achieve such big profits. That's one of the reasons why I am so disgusted with the recent election results.

[Stoke]

Just because the shoes are made in China doesn't mean that the factories are 'sweat shops'. That implies that the workers get absolutely no benefits, no breaks, work 12+ hrs/day, and they make barely enough to survive. Adidas has the factories in China because the workers will work for less pay, and there's nothing morally wrong with that, because the same job in a Chinese-based company would pay even less.

The real issue is that Adidas is taking jobs away from America, and therefore hurting our economy. They could have all their factories here in America, but then they wouldn't make nearly as much profit.

[mohkale]

This is a little off topic, sorry. But why would a german company put all their factories in America?

[Jeremy]

that's a silly question - America's the most important country in the world

Actually I agree - I've made my point of view on nationalism pretty clear in the past and I never by products because they are made in Australia.

The point about having workshops in places where the people will work for less means that the place stays really poor - wage rises will never rise because if they do the company just moves to somewhere else where they can pay less and all the people in China lose their jobs.

[Stoke]

This is a little off topic, sorry. But why would a german company put all their factories in America?

Ok I wasn't completely sure of where Adidas was based, but the point was that they're taking the jobs away from that country.

[philthevoid]

foreign labour is actually a pretty complex issue. like sure, they might work in shitty conditions for long hours with no breaks for barely any money but in some of these countries its either that or death.

i can willingly admit that, and i admit that there are alot of benefits to cheap labour like this. it helps build foreign economies and, theoretically, eventually as the standard of living in those countries rises then sweatshops will be eliminated.

but this is all a pipedream. we live in the here and now and while these factories neglect their employees, they are also generally environmentally irresponsible.

those reasons are enough to make me want to not support them, along with the fact that while lavers would probably make footbag somewhat better, it wont enrich my life or find me true happiness. they are a pair of shoes. i dont need them to survive and be happy and, as such, i dont feel the need to screw other people over so i can wear them.

but this issue is definately two sided and usually when i discuss this with others i play the role of devils advocate because all the environmentally/socially concious people i know always seem to focus on the bad side of it. this is fine and i agree with them but we cant ignore that there are two sides to this issue.

[canadian girl]

I completely agree with what Ryan Seath said, and while I can guiltily say that I have not been as good about refraining from buying from stores that support the use of sweat shops as I would like, I try my best and have a ton of respect for people who also exhibit this moral standpoint. So way to go to all of the people that try their hardest to boycott unfair labour (as well as violation of human rights, might I add), and to this particular post by username:

This statement disgusted and appalled me, and also made me laugh in that sort-of incredulous way, because it was (in my opinion) ignorant and egocentric:

Username said:

We're America, with a capital A, we are the main focus here, the big guy, and when we need things we speak up, and people do it.

[crazydwarf]

I try to never buy sweat shop manufactured stuff. Lots of my clothing is sewn in LA, not because I like LA but because it's a non sweat shop brand. I don't know how economy or anything like that works, but I would rather not support big companies who are only there to make a profit. If anyone saw The Copperation they'll know what I mean...

[philthevoid]

it sucks in alot of ways because most no sweat shoes suck.

birkenstocks are pretty cool though but i dont know how they'll fare for shredding, we'll see once ig et mine in the mail

[Senor Grommet]

If youre goin for sandals, you might as well get the Teva ones that Dave holton used to use, right? They're made in Israel as far as I know, at least they used to be, and "Teva" is an israeli word! SO that makes them a bit more authentic, no?

[Splint]

I think it sucks that most of us, like "username" take for "granite" the fact that we live in the countries where we we can afford to have choices in the careers we pursue. Our over-zealous capitalism often has us forgetting that there are people in other countries who, not only are less fortunate, but have no other choice than to take whatever shitty fuckin' job that comes along for a nickle an hour so that they can help feed their families.

What's worse is that we forget that American society was just like that until Labor Laws and Unions were created to fight for the American Worker. What's even worse is that all these trade organizations and big businesses have found ways to legally outsource production to countries who do not have strict labor laws or any unions.

And what's worse than that... that there are dumb-fucks out there who decide it's easier to put down the few people who actually give a shit, rather than to take a stand themselves to make a difference in the world.

Phil rocks! I wish I was more like him (unless he wears womens' underwear ).

[Frenzal]

Does anyone actually know what the conditions are like in Adidas factories in China?

[cd]

Adidas apparel is actually made in factories owned by Asian corporations. For example, in Indonesia PT Dada makes clothes for ten different labels, including Adidas.

Here is an assessment of working conditions, done by the Workers Rights Consortium on a PT Dada factory:

http://www.workersrights.org/PTDada_Ind ... -26-02.pdf

I haven't read the whole thing (it's 55 pages), but it does describe a list of 5 of its more severe violations:

1. Punishing and Deterring Sick Leave- "...on the day they return from sick leave, to stand erect without moving for periods of one hour to entire workdays. The punishment is designed to humiliate workers, and inflicts physical hardship on convalescing workers."

2. Danger of Severe Heat Stress-"...several elements of the working environment pose significant risks of illness or even fatality as a reult of heat-related disorders, including dehydration, exhaustion, fainting, heat cramps, salt deficiency, heat exhaustion, and heat stroke. Many workers at PT Dada experience dizziness, exhaustion, dehydration, and fainting. [...] The factory has no air-conditioning and only a few small fans (some malfunctioning) in its very large production areas. [...] Many workers are required to stand in one position, doing repetitive tasks, throughout the workday. The vast majority of PT Dada workers are very young women of slight stature. The majority of women workers in Indonesia suffer some degree of iron deficiency anemia and are, thus, susceptible to rapid fatigue. PT Dada workers take their drinking water from large plastic bins containing hot water provided by an outside contractor. The water is sometimes discolored, malodorous, and distasteful."

3. (mandatory) Homework- "...PT Dada supervisers often require workers to continue their work at home, after working regular and overtime hours in the factory. The wage for homework is calculated by piece-rates which are far too low to enable workers to earn the statutory minimum wage... let alone statutory and company rates for overtime work."

4. Freedom of Association- There is substantial evidence that PT Dada has engaged in many serious acts of interference, intimidation, and retaliation against workers seeking to organize those unions which are not favored by manages. [...] One of the most severe acts of retaliation was the company's "solitary confinement" of a union supporter over a two week period in late 2001. The worker was required to spend her workdays-ranging from eight to twelve hours- working alone in a small, windowless, unventilated storage space. She was placed under guard, and permitted to obtain food and water only erratically and, on some days, not at all. [...] During lengthy and sometimes menacing interrogations by managers or supervisors, workers were told to break with the two disfavored unions and become members of the favored union. [...] The company is now deductiong union dues from many workers who unwillingly signed the [favored union's] membership forms."

5. Structural Hazards- (the report describes two hazards: the damaged roof where roofing materials threat to fall on people, and the possibility of a machine failing and crushing workers.)

There are a bunch of other things mentioned here, such as physical, verbal, sexual, and racial harassment, and failure to pay overtime, but the report is really long and I'm not going to go through the whole thing here. I left a lot out, so if you're interested, I urge you to read it for yourself.

It is hard to find a lot of info on these conditions because such places aren't really Adidas or Nike factories, but are under less well-known names. However, you can check out www.behindthelabel.org and www.corpwatch.org , they both provide research resources.

[Frenzal]

Thanks Chris, enlightening.