Style vs. Difficulty

ToeGuiltless · Post by **ToeGuiltless** » 25 Dec 2002 21:55

style shouldnt be confused with smoothness, or flowy. style is anything. jerky, awkward, crouched, smooth, huge, fast, etc. i think style should come naturally, not preplanned.

NotHisRealName · Post by **NotHisRealName** » 26 Dec 2002 02:41

I think style comes naturally to all players. However, it lies in the exicution of the basics. Style is important to the players experssion of their routiene or run.
As the sport is relatively new, stlye and smoothness in the exicution of the tricks is most important. For the ignorant, the basics are almost unattanable feats of impossible skill. Therefore, stlye and smoothness is so much more impressive than busting the biggest of moves.

Acid~Reign · Post by **Acid~Reign** » 26 Dec 2002 04:50

I'd say style is most important in the long run. Almost anyone can appreciate an ugly looking, but extremely difficult run for a while, but it gets tiresome pretty quickly. People appreciate style longer and, from personal experience, the fun of hitting a relatively hard move continuosly wears off and what remains is the wanting to hit it while making it look good.

In terms of judging, there has to be a technical component and it should play a relatively large role in determining ranks.

Style could probably be likened to artwork. Some styles are smooth and graceful while others tend to be volatile, repugnant and just plain shocking. But unlike art, I don't think many people can appreciate the last two in footbag.

On a slight tangent, if everyone had perfect technique, would their styles be exactly the same too?

Grischa · Post by **Grischa** » 26 Dec 2002 05:22

Style and smoothness go together for me.
in a first place it is not important what kind of moves you hit, but how you actually hit them. the execution of the moves has to be clean, this is especially true for the public. for all non-players every move looks totally insane because they can not imagine to twist their own enkles in the same way as a footbag player.
if you accept this as the starting point, difficulty is of no importance and the only thing that mattes is execution. i dunno if it is more style or smoothness, for me it s both.

G*

Zerbalicious · Post by **Zerbalicious** » 26 Dec 2002 22:22

ToeGuiltless wrote: i think style should come naturally, not preplanned.

I couldn't disagree more

I just watched the Vortex for the first time and the grabs Cameron Kennedy does are phat! I know that shit took tons of practice to incorporate into his style.

I think people should put more thought into incorporating additional stylistic elements into their shred.
For the most part, the moves footbaggers do can be classified into the ADD catogories and I think that limits the sport.

It seems to me that most freestylers don't think about their arms when they kick. I love seeing cool arm stuff in shred. Like all that stuff Lon does when he puts his arms out after a spin, or Camerons grabs, or Scott D's "Threding" (I'm not a huge fan of that last one but at least he's trying something different)

Anyways here I am going off again and I don't even really do cool shit with my style at all. Mmmmmm???

Chris Holden · Post by **Chris Holden** » 27 Dec 2002 20:56

Correct me if I'm wrong (Toe Guiltless), but I think what he mean was, when you're kicking you dont PLAN your style, it's just what you do. Cameran does grabs, thus when kicking he doesn't plan to grab, it's just what he does. I kick with Red, and he does a lot of ducks, he doesn't plan on ducking that day, it's just his style, what he does. I suck, thus, I don't plan to suckit's just my style, lol.

ToeGuiltless · Post by **ToeGuiltless** » 27 Dec 2002 21:11

i wasnt really talking about whats moves you hit, but how you hit them. if everyone liked the way john doe does his barflies, and did them that way, it wouldnt be stylish anymore. it would be boring.

madshred2003 · Post by **madshred2003** » 28 Dec 2002 19:57

you're so funny quantumbalance! hahahaha you make me laugh like a plump school girl

Zerbalicious · Post by **Zerbalicious** » 29 Dec 2002 01:05

Chris Holden wrote: when you're kicking you dont PLAN your style, it's just what you do. Cameran does grabs, thus when kicking he doesn't plan to grab, it's just what he does. I

But Cameron did have to plan and practice to be able to do those grabs.

I think with planning and practice you can make your style better. Just like with practice you can make your game better. It's not like all of a sudden I could just do eclipse, I had to school my fucking ass off for that move.

I believe that when we put thought and practice into something it makes it more polished and more developed.

Look at the Viktor Kee's Juggling routine, (Cirque du Soleli's Dralion) That has tons of style. It took Viktor 3 years to develop all the movements in that routine and IMO it is one of the best routines, juggling or footbag, or rhythmic gymnastics wise I've ever seen.

Putting in time and effort to improve your style will improve your style. You may not plan to one day do a specific thing, but overall I think style is being neglected. It seems to me that people just worry about what moves they are hitting.

Sorry to go off again. It's all just fun and games

morsecode · Post by **morsecode** » 29 Dec 2002 09:57

You made some really good points, Zerbe. I feel that Style is something that has to be pursued equally as much as the technical aspect of footbag. I personally feel that (and this is not meant to offend anyone's style, because I myself don't shred like this) the ideal footbag motion is meant to be fluid and smooth, which doesn't necessarily mean slow. That sort of motion is the most accomodating for the body and shows that player has mastered the stuff he's hitting.

At the same time, I feel that once you lay a solid enough technical framework in any sort of skill, true emotional expression begins to take over and thats what renders the really amazing things. And it doesn't look like many players have reached that level. If that expression leads you to jerky, erratic motion, then that's totally great. But if you're jerky and awkward just because you've quickly rushing yourself through all of the sets seeking only to hit the trick rather than hit it well, it seems weird to say that's your style.

Once, again, this is just how I feel. i'm not saying i'm totally correct.

max · Post by **max** » 29 Dec 2002 12:04

just my two cents:
Some players have style to begin with. I've allready seen some novice players (just doing kicks and simple delays) and you could tell that they are going to have a very smooth style in freestyle footbaging. I know some people that don't really work on style but seem to have it anyway... (not my case

On the other hand you can work on overall style too. Rumor has it that Jan Zimmerman was recovering from knee pains and had to therefore play very very softly (i.e no slapping the ground hard) giving him the unique and incredible style he has today. Check it out here: http://www.sole-rebels.ch/ in the downloads section somewhere.

wicked · Post by **wicked** » 31 Dec 2002 19:18

I like to watch the bag... My favorite styles are the ones where the bag doesn't rotate much in the air. Where they set it strait. I love it when people play and u can just see each individual panel barely moving. Some guys when they play, the bag rotates severely in the air. This looks horrible. When the bag is barely rotating it shows such control.

I like it also when people are fast, but still at the same time. That stillness shows strength, unlike people who are all over the place, out of control.

Kick within your means, and be good at what u do. Even if thats only kicks or one adds.

ToeGuiltless · Post by **ToeGuiltless** » 01 Jan 2003 20:02

wicked is correct. if the bag spins, its because you are trying to dex the bag before it leaves your foot, which means the dex is slurry.
the bag should always go straight up, and straight down. we move around the bag, not vice-versa.

Zerbalicious · Post by **Zerbalicious** » 02 Jan 2003 08:38

I know some people like to put english on the bag.

QuantumBalance · Post by **QuantumBalance** » 02 Jan 2003 11:51

hey wicked ARE YOU READY TO KICK!?!?!? ill be back on sunday!

call chris call chad call yourself

yes

wicked · Post by **wicked** » 02 Jan 2003 14:34

Zerbe, maybe english would be cool, if you could also not put english on it. But people ive seen who have english on the bag (including myself) seem to do it because they have to, not because they have a choice of no english vs. english.

Eric.

Sam, busy till not this w/e but the next. Hey you left fournier off your call list. What gives?

<--- is that guy constapated or embarased? haha when you make one, in the typing filed it goes : oops :. cool huh?

wicked · Post by **wicked** » 02 Jan 2003 14:38

ToeGuiltless wrote: the bag should always go straight up, and straight down. we move around the bag, not vice-versa.

Whos "we" haha

Rob · Post by **Rob** » 02 Jan 2003 14:58

Forgive me if I'm gullible, or just dumb, but what is putting "english" on the bag?

Gabe · Post by **Gabe** » 02 Jan 2003 14:59

English is a spin, right? i learned it from playing pool.

Zerbalicious · Post by **Zerbalicious** » 02 Jan 2003 15:31

English is spin, like in pool

and I know what you're saying Wicked. It is lack of control when the bag goes spinning off those pixie sets and other stuff. But when it's controlled, it's fernizzy!!

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Style vs. Difficulty

Which is more important, style or difficulity?