Destroying the Video Market? (no video)

Splint · Post by **Splint** » 24 Apr 2005 23:23

I have recently become a bartender and I'm trying to learn flair (bottle flipping). I figured I'd go online and look for videos much like I would if I got on google and looked for footbag videos. I mean there are hundreds upon hundreds of free videos on footbag, from basics to total sickness.
When I look for Flair bartending I find very little that is free and a whole shitload that has to be paid for.

So I began to wonder whether the Internet and our style of community is killing our ability to put money into the footbag market. With all of the free online videos I haven't bought one in years and I'm sure I'm not the only one. Ellis has stopped making vids except for short freebees. Recently Monsterhack went under. Mostly because the money isn't there.

Am I wrong? Would you buy more videos wif you couldn't find them so easily accessible online?

ebo · Post by **ebo** » 25 Apr 2005 00:07

Probably not. I'm buying videos, and I will continue to do so, no matter
how much internet footage is being released.

There's a difference in internet video clips, most of which are below
10 minutes length (save for Evan's massive productions) and full
video productions 30 minutes+. I wouldn't buy videos with the length
most of the free internet videos have, because it just wouldn't be worth
it.

NotHisRealName · Post by **NotHisRealName** » 25 Apr 2005 02:33

I think it comes down to production values.
For filmes like Sick 03, the producers had to travel to a number of different locations to film the most awesome footage. That cost them money.

Most of the footage online is usually of one single event or one single player, filmed with a simple Digital DV camcorder and nothing more - usually at home or a local shred location. That means very low production values.

Sure there are people who produce some awesome looking videos for release online, but they do it for the love of it and because it cost them very little to do so.
But if you want a flash looking vid, then you gotta pay for it.

I think footbag is an underground sport and a very cheep one at that. There will never be big money in it unless people start to get greedy. Sure, there are people trying to make a living out of the sport, and they should be supported, but they do so not at the expence of the sport they love.

QuantumBalance · Post by **QuantumBalance** » 25 Apr 2005 05:50

I don't think they are "killing" the market, but I do think they are hurting it. That being said, I don't think it should change. It's true that usually videos you purchase are more well produced then videos you download. But, not always, so basically .. no oppinion. damn I didn't vote that though lol.

Asmus · Post by **Asmus** » 25 Apr 2005 10:02

I would buy videos more often if i could'nt download them..
But who says it would be good to put more money in to footbag?

QuantumBalance · Post by **QuantumBalance** » 25 Apr 2005 11:03

Maybe if the videos all cost money and couldn't be downloaded then there would be less people getting into the sport. That would suck. No ammount of money is worth changing peoples lives by introducing them to footbag.

david · Post by **david** » 25 Apr 2005 11:04

i thikn we shoud compile monthly releases of all videos that wouldve been online and sell it for 5 dollars on a cd. profits should go to ifpa or tournaments.

if you have heard of 411VM it is a skateboarding thing that does this. they realease monthly volumes with segments from everywhere.

so just image:

Shred Collection April '05 Featuring
- jorden moir - cosmic session
- tom mosher - battle 1
- john mahood/brad nelson - battle 1
- east coast championships documentary
- david clavens session highlights.

the footy could be sent to one person who would gather it all and burn it all out, and sell it. idk, i think its a good idea.

-david

ericksonj · Post by **ericksonj** » 25 Apr 2005 11:52

david wrote: - david clavens session highlights.

haha self plug!

j/k I think a comiplation cd/dvd of online vids would be cool, but would people really pay for it if they already have the vids and could do the same for themselves?

footjoe · Post by **footjoe** » 25 Apr 2005 11:52

Thats a good idea david , Like at chilly philly when I gave you 5$ for that cd of vids I couldnt download , im down for that

Sporatical_Distractions · Post by **Sporatical_Distractions** » 25 Apr 2005 18:14

about barflair videos: I thought you were getting the book of cool brad.

TwistedTorque · Post by **TwistedTorque** » 26 Apr 2005 05:16

Ya, on the bar flair subject:
The Book of Cool is Amazing!
You should just buy that if you are looking for bar flair vids. Supreme Quality.

On the thread subject, I would buy more vids if they're weren't available. If they were release frequently and quickly (up to date shred footage) and if it was easier to get (not order online, like if it was at the local skate shop). I think if people released previews of upcoming videos, that would help, kinda like a movie trailer. Just a shred trailer. When I saw the Sick 03 trailer, that made me HUNT down those guys at worlds. I hounded them for it and got it even though it was PAL. I knew it was Sick because of the preview. It blew away my expectations too.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 26 Apr 2005 05:59

I really liked David's 411VM idea. Infact I liked it so much I'm going to do it (if that's ok with Dave...)

Everybody who wants to contribute to the video send me a copy of your exclusive vid (exclusive as in nobody except me knows about it) - either a link or a phsyical copy - obviously the higher the quailty the better. I'll edit it and put it onto a dvd. Then I'll work out how much the operation costs - sell the vid for an appropriate price and pay everybody who contributes footage a percentage (including the IFPA)

In order to make sure there is a demand for the video - only footage showing a high level of skill will be used - sorry to intermediate players, but maybe you can aspire to be on the vids one day.

hacksterbator · Post by **hacksterbator** » 26 Apr 2005 06:21

i voted yes. look at ellis eutopia production. where is it? never happened, and my guess as to why is because most of the footage that he was taking the time to edit well, in good old ellis fasion, had been spread all over the internet in quick clips here and there. who really wants to pay to see the same footage, but from a different angle? how quickly footage comes out online after an event really limits what other video producers can use in a video for sale. i'm not sure if it should change though, free is always good right?

max · Post by **max** » 26 Apr 2005 06:26

good point Andrew.
Another problem with DVD / VHS videos is this:
Shred footage gets out of date very fast.

Fred and Pierre took a year editing BB and Sick03 (+ 1 year for footage of Sick 03), by the time they came out, the shred was not fresh / cutting edge anymore. Still good vids in my opinion quality / editing-wise but there's one things that internet-released vids have over DVDs : the footage is brand spanking new (usually).

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 26 Apr 2005 06:31

That's true, but look at champion's league.

Imagine the only free footage online of Vasek from now on was his competition footage. Would you pay for more footage then?

Free is definitly better for people who aren't prepared to pay money - but I think free is also what's holding footbag back - there's no money in the sport. Personally I hope one day there is so that people who are dedicated enough can spend all there time playing footbag and still manage to survive. I love this sport too much and I want everybody in the world to play it.

ptaku · Post by **ptaku** » 26 Apr 2005 06:58

Maybe I'm a selfish dick but...

What THE FUCK are you talking about? Free internet videos are holding footbag back? Bullshit... I see no way it could... I wouldn't buy shred videos, even when there wouldn't be any free footage... Why? Because I don't have money to do it! I must spare money for half a year to buy new bag... Paying 20$, euros or anything else for video + shipping from US, or at least from CZ is pretty expensive for me... Man... It's damn expensive... It's overcharge! And because of that I wouldn't have any oportunity to watch some footage...

Please delete this topic... Please! Just wait to see how people will stop making internet vids, because you are talking that it holds footbag back!

This thread drove me mad...

qphox · Post by **qphox** » 26 Apr 2005 08:47

I don't understand your qualm Ptaku. It's a legitimate question.

I think Sam has had the strongest counterpoint so far:

"Maybe if the videos all cost money and couldn't be downloaded then there would be less people getting into the sport."

That made me nod my head and think, "Good point."

Colin · Post by **Colin** » 26 Apr 2005 09:27

Yep... Free internet videos built the current footbag community, in my humble opinion. Konabeach2 made me a freestyler for life.

Why was there all of a sudden such a huge jump between net and freestyle? Didn't they have roughly equal amounts of players at one point? The internet made it happen

.

That said, we do need cash... I don't think that a $5 monthly DVD is feasible, but what about a $5 / month subscription to some website (modified.ca?) that gives you access to the months video input from the community? And in order to keep the stream of new players aided by free vids, offer a free month to new members, or ever a few free months, and after this time is up, give non-payers one video per month.

Hell, if we gave new members free vids for a year it would still leave us making more than we did before.

I dunno. People probably won't pay 5 bucks a month when they won't even pay 10 bucks a year for IFPA membership.

sen · Post by **sen** » 26 Apr 2005 09:35

OK, here's the thing. . . I love this sport becasue it doesn't cost much to play. I don't have to invest ALOT of money on equipment to start playing, and I don't HAVE to pay money to see what's being hit around the world. I can see new moves and learn tricks for free. I LOVE that. That's why I stick to footbag. Video's got me addicted and have kept me that way.

KEEP IT FREE!

Colin · Post by **Colin** » 26 Apr 2005 10:03

You only get out of something what you put into it... Applies on all scales.

We all eventually need to give something back to the community.

Destroying the Video Market? (no video)

Are online footbag videos killing the market?

Destroying the Video Market? (no video)