Drug talk on Modified

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 05 May 2005 07:46

Great post!!

Puts Amelia in the "good book"

I think it's a good solution too. Or maybe it doesn't have to even be a mod. I think most of us are pretty mature - if you see a topic you don't think should be discussed - sending the person a pm about it might be a great idea.

hmm or it might start underground fights everywhere

I like the idea anyway

habitat · Post by **habitat** » 05 May 2005 08:55

not to sound like a little bitch or an idiot, but I felt almost no need to read all 3 pages of this discussion. No offence to anyone, but I don't think this thread will have any positive outcome and is pretty much pointless. Mods should do their job when the line is crossed or when they see fit. This isn't some dictatorship or anything either. Mods should use their moderatorility (kidding) when needed

drug topics won't be stopped because there is always some new that doesn't know the topic is unwanted. Let's not fight about every little damn thing for once. I swear the discusion forum's main purpose is to give us footbaggers somethign to do when we are bored at work or school or to find new enemies

Don't post in a drug thread and it will go no where and then it will be lost in the list. play footbag and keep it clean

junkyardjew · Post by **junkyardjew** » 05 May 2005 09:50

I was under the impression that Discussion and Footblogs couldn't be seen by people who weren't logged in. Is this not true? People may have noticed that I post almost exclusively in the discussion/kicking circle forums.

That's not because I don't like footbag, it's because I have no advice to give somebody trying to hit torque or whatever - I can barely seal legovers...

So i hang out on modified to talk to people who share my interests (ie, footbag, politics and drugs). My two cents is that censorship is bogus, and (this is for you jeremy) - the true will of the people is rarely if ever mirrored in public policy. This is ESPECIALLY true of drug policy. For example in Canada, two thirds of the country want marijuana completely legalized (most believe (rightly) that decriminalization is a scam) but it still doesn't get done.

BainbridgeShred · Post by **BainbridgeShred** » 05 May 2005 10:07

No offence to anyone, but I don't think this thread will have any positive outcome and is pretty much pointless. Mods should do their job when the line is crossed or when they see fit.

Yes, and what is being discussed is what the mods "job" is. When is the line crossed? Is their a line at all? I think the line should be drawn somewhere around kiddy porn.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 05 May 2005 11:20

I think the main role of mods - at least most of what I do is to delete double posts, move topics to the right sub forum and fix people's php script errors. Apart from that I send messages to people I think are getting out of hand and tell them to chill or to new members to welcome them and to tell them to put a name in their signature. It's very rare that we actually edit or delete posts.

I think modified is one of the most liberally run internet forums I have come across. I think we allow for much more leeway than other forums I've visited (non footbag). I'm very proud of the way the forum is run and the maturity of the members.

The forum has not always been like that. There were, as I like to refer to them, the dark ages - but there are very little records from that era.

I believe that the current moderators - myself excluded - are both very well respected in the community and have excellent judgement. I am more than willing to respect and follow backup their judgement. If they do do something I initially disagree with - I'll bring it up on the moderator/admin forum or I'll message them and ask for an explanation. A great example of this was Bradmin editing a post in this topic. I completely disagreed with the decision and sent him a number of messages. We managed to easily understand each other and I'm happy with the outcome. I sincerely hope that other people feel the same way towards myself as I feel towards the other moderators. I also sincerely hope that everybody feels that if the mods do something you disagree with - that you can confront them on the issue and be respected rather than dismissed.

I guess it's the posts from James and Amelia demonstrate this point. I think the solution to this issue is to trust the moderators and definitly query them on any decision you disagree with.

As I said earlier - personally I don't want to see topics about drugs (or any other topic with in reason) locked - but I don't really want to see the issues discussed either. If Matt or Emily or any of the mods feels differently about this - and I know they do. I'll respect their decision and I'm sure that when I make decisions, they'll respect those too.

habitat · Post by **habitat** » 05 May 2005 11:33

kinda off main topic, but to say ban censorship would be not be desired. If not, you would turn on the tv to channel 3 and see someone pooping on a shemales chest, and thats just not kosh. Really, think about it, censorship isn't all bad in some cases. Sure that example is pretty extreme, I hope you get the message im trying to convey. and their definately is a line way before kiddy porn

Anyways, I trust and respect all the mods on our little ol' forum. So I would agree to let them decide and make the choices until I see a decision that conflicts with my interests. The line should be what the mods say the line is. Sure I sound like a little follower or something, but this isn't really a huge deal, lets say life threatening, so lets not fight until something ACTUALLY happens from now on. Then the gloves come off

btw, I just juggled 4 balls, with one ball being a basketball

sampotter · Post by **sampotter** » 05 May 2005 14:38

As far as I see it, moderators are people with a certain element of maturity and leadership in their personality who reflect the opinions of the mass of the people on a forum. They keep the forum pointed in the right direction, and when enough people are upset about something that is going on, the moderator does something about it. That's what has happened here. I think a viable solution might be to either 1) delete the off-topic forums and let the people create a new forum with new moderators, or 2) change the moderators and make those forums viewable by members only. This way the people who want to talk about whatever ridiculous bull shit they feel like have the area to do so and people won't be offended. It also eliminates the problem of people keeping close to the forums topic. You can say, "Ohh, ban censorship," (sort of an oxymoron, heh) but nothing here is being censored. Imagine you're taking a class and are about to have a discussion on something you read the previous night. You show up, and immediately someone raises their hand and chimes in about how much cocaine they railed off a toilet seat last night at a party when the book was on something entirely different. If people want to talk about this, they should be able to. I just think that the framework we have established here is a poor one.

Moxie · Post by **Moxie** » 05 May 2005 17:06

Jeremy wrote:As I said earlier - personally I don't want to see topics about drugs (or any other topic with in reason) locked - but I don't really want to see the issues discussed either. If Matt or Emily or any of the mods feels differently about this - and I know they do. I'll respect their decision and I'm sure that when I make decisions, they'll respect those too.

I did not lock any topics, and I didn't say "lets not talk about any drugs." I was proposing that we try to prevent further discussion of heroine and ask people not to talk about heroine specifically. I have a strong ill-will towards it and have seen some really ugly things in my life because of it. I feel that having Modified is a privilege, and I like knowing that I can feel comfortable send new people here. So I thought, "maybe this (heroine) isn't something which should be talked about openly in a positive manner here."

At this point, if I had my way, all that would happen would be that we ask people not to discuss hard drugs. That's it. If I took it one step further, I would ask if there could be only one topic on marijuana specificaly. Kind of like how I'd feel if there were two separate topics on "How to lace your lavers" or something.
______________
Emily Kulczyk

"Unity to be real must stand the severest strain without breaking" --Mahatma Gandhi (Indian philosopher, internationally esteemed for his doctrine of nonviolent protest, 1869-1948)

BainbridgeShred · Post by **BainbridgeShred** » 05 May 2005 17:40

but to say ban censorship would be not be desired. If not, you would turn on the tv to channel 3 and see someone pooping on a shemales chest, and thats just not kosh.

No, this would never happen because their is not a market for it. Just as there really aren't that many drugs threads on this forum because not many people (Including myself) want to talk about drugs.

CIC flurry · Post by **CIC flurry** » 06 May 2005 00:42

A little analogy...

I do try to present a good image of the sport when we're out there in real life. I remeber one time when we were kicking, and these guys came up to kick with us, then asked if we had weed to sell...and the people with me DID! I could not help but feel a part of that. Like, let's just add drug dealers to the bottom of our club shirts right under the "freestyle footbag" part.

Similarly, at tournaments/jams...it seems that drugs are always at the afterparties. I am generally put off by this, and I usually go somewhere else. Lately I just don't go to the afterparties anymore. But once i remember that alot of new people came to the afterparty. Alot of young people. Some not even in high school. And I can tell that many of them were shocked by what they saw...thankfully they left before some *ahem* other people were invited who brought some hard drugs...I can't say what even the marijuana smokers thought of people shooting up or smoking crack in ther afterparty.

I've restricted my comments to public situations. (I call the afterparty public too). Suffice to say I think this gives the sport a bad image to people who'd rather not be around drugs. In many cases we are the minority, and I just bust out of the situation and let the peeps have their fun.

I wouldn't apply this analogy directly to this discussion because i feel like the internet is a bit different. Talking about (for example) abortion here and holding a big sign outside of a jam are 2 different things. There is a big ass BEWARE! outside of this sub forum, and plenty of ther topics to read...that being said, i don't like seeing the drug posts and what not...but I'm against censoring in general.....now with that being said: alot of peeps brought up alot good points about moderation.

~The T-Bone Experience

delakong · Post by **delakong** » 06 May 2005 07:30

Obviously some of the laws in any given country do not express how a majority of any given country feel. A majority of people in the US support medicinal marijuana, and have for a long time, yet it is still illegal. I really agree with who ever said that we should not ban certain topics because of the getting to know thing. I consider most people on modified friends, and if I ever get the opportunity to go to a competition I'd like to see people for who they are. I don't want to get to an afterparty and *gasp* see _________ taking a bong hit. My morning glory seed post was bad, but when I posted it I'm pretty sure the top post at the time was "who here has tried salvia".

There is a warning on the discussion. If you don't like these kind of topics, don't read them. People that do drugs are gonna do drugs regardless of what is posted on modified. I agree with Dan (I think) about parents being as turned off by political discussions as much as drug discussions (not to mention our wonderful religious topics

). [/b]

BrianP · Post by **BrianP** » 06 May 2005 16:35

First thing, I unfortunatly have to agree with the idea that parents are not going to be any more troubled with drug conversations than with religious conversations; the reason for this is that parents who would search on their children's computers to make sure their children are making proper use of internet privledges are probably going to be overly and equally irritated by many topics. Other parents will probably not ever see the drug section, especially if their children are not responding to and/or reading posts on drugs.
I do not do drugs, and in fact vehemently oppose the use of most illegal (heroine included) and many legal drugs; this does not cause me to wish a ban a move of drug related topics. The forums here are a good place for those who play footbag to connect to other players with common outside interests, and if they wish to openly talk about the use and manufacturing of an LSD-like compound from morning glory seeds or whatever, then so be it. My feeling is this: if a large enough number of members of this community want to talk about these kinds of topics, they have as much right as those who want to say god is dead, or whatever. Many people are much more offended by anti-religious statements than they are by drug related statments. Also, the reason that footbag is viewed as a pothead stoner sport happens to be because a lot of people who play smoke pot or eat acid and are not shy to tell you about it. A lot of people in other sports do a lot of drugs too, but they also make a lot of money, are in the public eye, and are much more likely to be arrested than are members of a sport not so heavily in the public eye. And I really don't think the drug related image of the sport has anything to do with it's not being included in the Olympics; seriously, snowboarding is a good example of a sport commonly associated with drugs (even before the gold medal/pot incident) that still made it into the olympics. I also think that topics like this can be a good way to make people think about how strong their opinons really are. Anyway, that was my rambling two cents. Ya'll have a good day.
Brian

habitat · Post by **habitat** » 06 May 2005 17:13

CIC flurry wrote:thankfully they left before some *ahem* other people were invited who brought some hard drugs...I can't say what even the marijuana smokers thought of people shooting up or smoking crack in ther afterparty.

wow dude, if I seen someone slamming some dope at a footbag party, I would be like wtf? I would probably then leave as well, fuck crack

comastalker · Post by **comastalker** » 07 May 2005 07:47

Jeremy wrote:I do think it's a question of legality because as I explained - legality represents what society thinks as acceptable.

No ! It's what media tells the majority to think about what to accept !
Don't be so damn ignorant.

comastalker · Post by **comastalker** » 07 May 2005 07:55

you ask yourself if you (or the mods) should act like the governments you live under. Let me point out this :

In the netherlands, marijuana, mushrooms and peyote have been decriminalized; in germany not.
Relative to the population, the quantity of THC smokers in germany is 5 times as high as in the netherlands.
In fact, smoking weed in netherlands is more like an underground thing than in germany.

Repression is senseless, but I think most of the world population (you being a representative part of it) will never understand that.

BainbridgeShred · Post by **BainbridgeShred** » 07 May 2005 10:44

Nothing you pointed out is relevent to this topic, or has not already been dealt with.

comastalker · Post by **comastalker** » 07 May 2005 11:16

it is :

the first one is about jeremys argument about the majorities opinion
the second one about the use of repression -> censorship = kind of repression

you're always complaining about people discussing in a way that does not really fit a necessary niveau. Complaining about statements that obviously apply to a topic because you're just to lazy to think about the relation also ain't a good way to dicuss sth. too

BainbridgeShred · Post by **BainbridgeShred** » 07 May 2005 12:27

Well when you tell someone your arguing with not to be "so damned ignorant" after we've already discussed flaming in this topic, it doesn't make me want to reply to your comments intelligently, and also leads me to believe that you haven't read this thread throughly.

In the netherlands, marijuana, mushrooms and peyote have been decriminalized; in germany not.
Relative to the population, the quantity of THC smokers in germany is 5 times as high as in the netherlands.
In fact, smoking weed in netherlands is more like an underground thing than in germany.

This isn't relevent because it doesn't matter whether weed should be legalized or not, because as pointed out that isn't the point of this argument.

Repression is senseless, but I think most of the world population (you being a representative part of it) will never understand that.

What do you have to back this claim up? Don't make this argument so romanticized, we're talking about whether drugs should be discussed on a hacky sack forum for God's sake.

comastalker · Post by **comastalker** » 07 May 2005 12:38

BainbridgeShred wrote:
Repression is senseless, but I think most of the world population (you being a representative part of it) will never understand that.
What do you have to back this claim up?

the above statement you said was useless. There are also thousands of other examples; like all psychological problems e.g.

And my analogy is one example for the fact that repression ends up being worse than the problem and making the problem itself worse.
By censoring anything on the forum you won't keep anyone from taking drugs and a lot of people talk about irresponsible behaviour when talking about drugs on this forum. To censor these posts won't change anything, neither related to our sport nor related to any society in general.

Btw.: To tell someone not to be "so damned ignorant" ain't flaming. I'm neither getting personal nor degrading.

A fact is : My statements are objectively related to this topic, even if you don't like it. If you have problems with my opinion, please tell me, but do not blindly call it unrelated. Ando no, I do not feel offended you also shouldn't.

dragonhack · Post by **dragonhack** » 18 May 2005 13:40

Splint wrote:Recently there have been some topics on Modified that have been somewhat disturbing. The Salvia thread and the Morning Glory Seed thread being the two most recent.
Personally I thought it was a bit much to dedicate more than one thread to weed. As an online footbag community member I (and others) wonder to what extent drug topics should really be discussed.

I am by no means a prude and have done more than enough drugs to back it up. Even so, I consider there to be a line between what you do and how you present yourself. In the case of Modified, I consider it representing the larger community.

So what image do we as a community wish to present?

i will totally agree with you about the possible over abundance of drug topics,however, i do believe that in no way should the morning glory seed / salvia threads should be locked or erased or whatever seeing as though that neither are illegal in any way shape or form, it is not illegal to be under the influence of either of these drugs nor is it illegal or posesses or sell these plants, if they were illegal i would agree that the thread could be deemed innapropriate(like a marijane thread,due to it's illegality).

Drug talk on Modified

Re: Drug talk on Modified