Hi hacky folks.
I used climacools for 2 years or so (just a little less, actually). I've just switched back to lavers. Here are some thoughts on the whole matter.
I originally switched to climacools primarily because of the lightness. I also liked the huge toe stall zone, the super sensitive inside, and the cushioniness of the sole. Since using them, I've had some further thoughts on these features of the shoe.
Weight - no argument there, super light.
Cushioniness of the sole - this is really nice when you're landing those big symposium tricks, but in almost no play time at all, the sole starts to compress at the outside. The sole is very soft, and this model is a running shoe that is meant for forward motion. All the lateral motion in footbag compresses the outsides of the sole, which makes the shoes tilt towards the outside. The tilt plus the squishiness leads to *A GREATLY INCREASED TENDENCY TO ROLL YOUR ANKLES, AND HENCEFORTH, INJURE YOURSELF*
Huge toe stall zone - is sweet.
Inside surface - not nearly as flat as lavers. leads to inconsistency of clipper / inside sets. i think tom will back me up on this one.
So, it's really those last two issues that have caused me to switch back to lavers. Lavers are heavier, but feel more stable under me.
Climas are fun, and I was able to hit some fast shit in them, but I'm sure I can do it with lavers once my legs are reconditioned, and the switch back has not been problematic.
Just some thoughts. I'd love to know what other clima users think of these comments, and I'd like to know their comments as well.
Some thoughts on Climacools - Read before buying!
Some thoughts on Climacools - Read before buying!
BRICK!
rfa::never give up::
nyfa
rfa::never give up::
nyfa
My main two factors for buying Climas are:
1) weight of shoe
2) (and most importantly) well-being of legs
A bunch of people have told me that Climacools have not only completely expelled shin splints, but that they are super wicked (in a good way) on your knees too -- and these are the biggest factors in my game; if I can play without having to worry about these two things, I will be SOOO happy. Plus being faster would make me awesome.
What are some thoughts on the health benefits of Climas? 'Cause if nobody really says anything impressive then maybe I won't bother.
1) weight of shoe
2) (and most importantly) well-being of legs
A bunch of people have told me that Climacools have not only completely expelled shin splints, but that they are super wicked (in a good way) on your knees too -- and these are the biggest factors in my game; if I can play without having to worry about these two things, I will be SOOO happy. Plus being faster would make me awesome.
What are some thoughts on the health benefits of Climas? 'Cause if nobody really says anything impressive then maybe I won't bother.
I thought they would do wonders for my shin splints but to my disappointment my shins felt the same as they did when i play in lavers. I don't know how they worked out for other people...... but they didnt do much for my shins
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I've played in Climas for 1.5 years now, played in lavers for a bout a year before that. I switched because of my knees. Climas are a proper sport shoe so the sole support really does help especially for knee problems. It doesn't help for shin splints (well I still have bad shin splints).
The sole does compress quickly however I havent noticed it compressing on the outside. That could just be the natural roll of your feet. Mine compress evenly not causing any additional harm to your ankles. However the therapudic benefits to the knees are also gone so you need new ones relatively often.
I find toes and clippers on lavers better but only slightly and the benefits of using a proper sports shoe far outweigh that.
I don't like G6s, they're just too bulky (after getting used to Climas) and they grip too much and they are almost as bad as Lavers for knees.
The worst thing about Climas is modding. They are a bitch to mod.
Guido
The sole does compress quickly however I havent noticed it compressing on the outside. That could just be the natural roll of your feet. Mine compress evenly not causing any additional harm to your ankles. However the therapudic benefits to the knees are also gone so you need new ones relatively often.
I find toes and clippers on lavers better but only slightly and the benefits of using a proper sports shoe far outweigh that.
I don't like G6s, they're just too bulky (after getting used to Climas) and they grip too much and they are almost as bad as Lavers for knees.
The worst thing about Climas is modding. They are a bitch to mod.
Guido
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shreddaily
- Flower Child
- Posts: 1665
- Joined: 03 Sep 2003 16:56
uhhhhhh what else is there than toes and inside???
form=injuries
shoe=excuse
---
Hmm, thats a pretty arrogant reply.
Well, Climas helped my knees full stop. Ofcourse form makes a huge difference, equiptment in any sport also helps, in my case my equiptment helped (my knees) a lot.
Also, myself (or this thread) never made any excuses about anything. Why try to turn a thread that may be productive and helpfull to someone into a debate about bullshit.
form=injuries
shoe=excuse
---
Hmm, thats a pretty arrogant reply.
Well, Climas helped my knees full stop. Ofcourse form makes a huge difference, equiptment in any sport also helps, in my case my equiptment helped (my knees) a lot.
Also, myself (or this thread) never made any excuses about anything. Why try to turn a thread that may be productive and helpfull to someone into a debate about bullshit.
Guido Tapia
I don't think I quite agree with you on those last points, buddy. if your shoes are squishy and somewhat unstable in the sole, and they're tilted strangely from using them for something other than their intended purpose (by, say, playing footbag from side to side instead of running forward with them), you could be a lot more prone to injury.
also, guido wouldn't be the first to note that laver cushioning isn't quite the best.
matt
also, guido wouldn't be the first to note that laver cushioning isn't quite the best.
matt
BRICK!
rfa::never give up::
nyfa
rfa::never give up::
nyfa
Climas have prevented shin splints for me. When you shred climas, you have to pull your toe up to take full advantage of the huge toe area. This forces you to work the muscles that will prevent shin splints. If climas didn't make your shin splints go away, maybe you need to "crank" your toe a little more. I know that sounds wierd, but it doesn't make sense that shin splints can survive if you're basically doing constant toe-taps (acutally just flexing and pointing your toe, which is even better anyway) while you shred.
I've shred in climas since (roughly) christmas of this year. At KICKASS II I had to cake my knees in tiger balm in order to play at all. I used nearly the entire jar during that weekend, and it was the extra-strength red stuff. After KICKASS II I took a 2 month brake from shred because my knees would hurt so bad when I played. I whent to some physio and I had X-rays done and all sorts of stuff to make my knee pain go away, and then when I got my climas, my knee pains left. I haven't had any knee pain since then. I'll admit that I did roll my ankle once just after christmas, but my climas were brand new so it wasn't because of them. I was getting sloppy while I was skooling drifters. I haven't had any problems with my legs/ankles/feet since then. Climas are definately good for your knees and your shins.
Also, I don't agree with the surfaces on Lavers being better at all! The toe areas are not even comparable, 'specialy if you "crank" your toe up. And my osis reccord whent from like, 7 or something stupid like that to 37 within the first week of having Climas. The clipper is pretty rockin'. With the plastic stripes cut off, a brocka mod and a little bit of silicone in the right place, I argue that the clipper surface on climas is the best out of all the shoes we've got right now. I certainly preffer it over any other clipper surface I've used.
I looooooooooooooooooooooooooove climas!
Definately, they are far and away my favorite footbag shoe that's available right now.
However, that is an interesting point that you make, Matt Cross. I hadn't really considered that they are specifiacally designed for running forward. It makes sense that that would cause problems in the long run. (ha... long run.) The sole is also thicker, which probably does make ankle injuries more likely.
The problems with climas:
-Higher risk of ankle injury
-Less durable
-Harder to find/more expensive
But... IMO, they are better than any other shoe in all other respects.
-Better toe
-Better clipper
-Better leg health
-Lighter
-Potential for a tighter fit (since they're stretchy)
-Awsomer
However, I hate G-units. Some people swear by them, but I can't stand them. ...So, to each his own. I reccomend Climas. They're my favorite.
I've shred in climas since (roughly) christmas of this year. At KICKASS II I had to cake my knees in tiger balm in order to play at all. I used nearly the entire jar during that weekend, and it was the extra-strength red stuff. After KICKASS II I took a 2 month brake from shred because my knees would hurt so bad when I played. I whent to some physio and I had X-rays done and all sorts of stuff to make my knee pain go away, and then when I got my climas, my knee pains left. I haven't had any knee pain since then. I'll admit that I did roll my ankle once just after christmas, but my climas were brand new so it wasn't because of them. I was getting sloppy while I was skooling drifters. I haven't had any problems with my legs/ankles/feet since then. Climas are definately good for your knees and your shins.
Also, I don't agree with the surfaces on Lavers being better at all! The toe areas are not even comparable, 'specialy if you "crank" your toe up. And my osis reccord whent from like, 7 or something stupid like that to 37 within the first week of having Climas. The clipper is pretty rockin'. With the plastic stripes cut off, a brocka mod and a little bit of silicone in the right place, I argue that the clipper surface on climas is the best out of all the shoes we've got right now. I certainly preffer it over any other clipper surface I've used.
I looooooooooooooooooooooooooove climas!
Definately, they are far and away my favorite footbag shoe that's available right now.
However, that is an interesting point that you make, Matt Cross. I hadn't really considered that they are specifiacally designed for running forward. It makes sense that that would cause problems in the long run. (ha... long run.) The sole is also thicker, which probably does make ankle injuries more likely.
The problems with climas:
-Higher risk of ankle injury
-Less durable
-Harder to find/more expensive
But... IMO, they are better than any other shoe in all other respects.
-Better toe
-Better clipper
-Better leg health
-Lighter
-Potential for a tighter fit (since they're stretchy)
-Awsomer
However, I hate G-units. Some people swear by them, but I can't stand them. ...So, to each his own. I reccomend Climas. They're my favorite.
Ben Roscoe
Im gonna have to argue with some of these points. I played in climas for a few sessions in chicago, and here is what i think about the surfaces.
Toe= worst toe area out of all the footbag shoes. Even worse than the New Balance CT 300 and 520.
Clipper=best out of all the footbag shoes. causes sloppy clipper form (at least it did for me)
and yeah they were light and nice, but the toe was almost impossible for me to use. So round.
Toe= worst toe area out of all the footbag shoes. Even worse than the New Balance CT 300 and 520.
Clipper=best out of all the footbag shoes. causes sloppy clipper form (at least it did for me)
and yeah they were light and nice, but the toe was almost impossible for me to use. So round.
JSACK wrote:alright well me and obara'bars, shredded our dicks off, since we are both in high school, obviously there is some sort of talent show
Ok, so people dont know me here, i think this is only my second post.
I've only been shredding for four months, so I cant tell you the the risks of hitting super nemesis in climas. I can tell you however, that i have relativly good form, average crank, and have played in g-units, lavers, and climas
Climas-
first day i played in these modded was the first day I hit barfly bsos, the first time i hit flipside whirl, the first time i hit ducking and diving butterfly (bs), the first time I hit dimwalk flipside ( which is stupid cause its so easy). So you can see I think they play well
second day i played in them i almost rolled my ankle twice, but that hasnt happened since.
I havent played in them long enough to have the outside foam squish down, but could definentaly see that happening
Clipper- awsome (modded at least) Completely flat, best of the three shoes
-g-units slope out (can lead to bad form, but very stable so there is probably less chance of a rolled ankle
-lavers slope very slightly in, no problem for matt cross who has awsome crank, and i dont have a roll-of problem, but thier still not as nice as g-units
Toe-too taughnt and thick, doesnt compare to lavers (lavers puff up around the bag, and you can feel the bag), more consistant than g-units
Like someone else said, they have a higher profile, which might be a problem.
Something else id like to add, the cusionsing in the toes is much thinner, because when you run, the force is absorbed in your heel, but footbag it played up on your toes, so while its better than lavera, its still not amazing if you play on your toes like you should (and i do play on my toes)
However, for those moves you have to rush, and therefore land on your heel, climas are great
I know i went a little of topic there, so...
In conclusion, matts points are very valid,
climas are already not as stable as lavers or g-units
( thier made for light, efficient runners with good form), and while I havent had mine long enough, i could see the outside collapsing
matt might also be more prone to rolling his ankles because they are so flexable
The solution- i think your safe buying climas if thier new, and then stop playing in them if the sole begins to collapse
Wow that post was huge
I've only been shredding for four months, so I cant tell you the the risks of hitting super nemesis in climas. I can tell you however, that i have relativly good form, average crank, and have played in g-units, lavers, and climas
Climas-
first day i played in these modded was the first day I hit barfly bsos, the first time i hit flipside whirl, the first time i hit ducking and diving butterfly (bs), the first time I hit dimwalk flipside ( which is stupid cause its so easy). So you can see I think they play well
second day i played in them i almost rolled my ankle twice, but that hasnt happened since.
I havent played in them long enough to have the outside foam squish down, but could definentaly see that happening
Clipper- awsome (modded at least) Completely flat, best of the three shoes-g-units slope out (can lead to bad form, but very stable so there is probably less chance of a rolled ankle
-lavers slope very slightly in, no problem for matt cross who has awsome crank, and i dont have a roll-of problem, but thier still not as nice as g-units
Toe-too taughnt and thick, doesnt compare to lavers (lavers puff up around the bag, and you can feel the bag), more consistant than g-unitsLike someone else said, they have a higher profile, which might be a problem.
Something else id like to add, the cusionsing in the toes is much thinner, because when you run, the force is absorbed in your heel, but footbag it played up on your toes, so while its better than lavera, its still not amazing if you play on your toes like you should (and i do play on my toes)
However, for those moves you have to rush, and therefore land on your heel, climas are great
I know i went a little of topic there, so...
In conclusion, matts points are very valid,
climas are already not as stable as lavers or g-units
( thier made for light, efficient runners with good form), and while I havent had mine long enough, i could see the outside collapsing
matt might also be more prone to rolling his ankles because they are so flexable
The solution- i think your safe buying climas if thier new, and then stop playing in them if the sole begins to collapse
Wow that post was huge
So wait, if I'm clear on this, Climas prevent shin splints because you're forced to crank your toes up to take advantage of the huge toe area? I think that's silly, since it's a form issue. And wouldn't having a small toe box make your accuracy in toe sets a little better?
For more than a month or so, I've laced the toebox on my Goonitz pretty constrictively at the second eyelet, making for a tighter, smaller box. I only did this because I think the toe area on the G-units is way too big for me and is one of the leading causes for my rolled ankles in the past (I usually play on my toes). I guess you can say it could also be argued as a form issue though. However, having laced my shoes in this way, it forced me to concentrate my toe sets even better, especially for pixies. Added that the toe walls for the G6 are super high, it was imperative (even now, having relaced in a different manner, but abiding to the second eyelet as before) for me to do toe-y stuff in proper form.
Whatever. If anyone plays in Rod Laver/Nastase Milleniums these days, those shoes have a small toe box. Sunil still plays in Rod Laver Milleniums, and he can still hit long and big pretty consistently these days. That's just my bias.
For more than a month or so, I've laced the toebox on my Goonitz pretty constrictively at the second eyelet, making for a tighter, smaller box. I only did this because I think the toe area on the G-units is way too big for me and is one of the leading causes for my rolled ankles in the past (I usually play on my toes). I guess you can say it could also be argued as a form issue though. However, having laced my shoes in this way, it forced me to concentrate my toe sets even better, especially for pixies. Added that the toe walls for the G6 are super high, it was imperative (even now, having relaced in a different manner, but abiding to the second eyelet as before) for me to do toe-y stuff in proper form.
Whatever. If anyone plays in Rod Laver/Nastase Milleniums these days, those shoes have a small toe box. Sunil still plays in Rod Laver Milleniums, and he can still hit long and big pretty consistently these days. That's just my bias.
Waylon Lew - maker of Wasabi bags
NYFA represent.
"Footbag can be pretty frustrating when it's supposed to be fun. I was partly driven by this forum - practice, practice, practice... As that is true, I think someone can be too focused on progressing and training that they miss the fun aspect of it." - Bander87
NYFA represent.
"Footbag can be pretty frustrating when it's supposed to be fun. I was partly driven by this forum - practice, practice, practice... As that is true, I think someone can be too focused on progressing and training that they miss the fun aspect of it." - Bander87
you guys are crazy.
i wont play in anything other than climas.
units: sucked...but they were good for osis. really thin surfaces. mine and hollys were destroyed before they were even broke in. hollys before she even used em.
lavers: bad for my body... but good surfaces. they were like bricks. no flex, and no support.
climas....
man i love climas. they feel so nice on my feet. they get rancid stank everytime i wear them. thats from no socks.
i think they compress, but if you play on your toes like your supposed to, then i think youd be alright. (not pointing fingers, just a statement). used climas are worse for this, because you didnt start the compression, so its advanced before you can mold them to footbag goodness. plus, theyd compress for running, not foobag.
i also think your ability to mod definetly hinders the shoes potential for many. everyone has to learn somehow though...
just so long as i get two or three more pairs, i think ill be fine.
keep your lavers
i wont play in anything other than climas.
units: sucked...but they were good for osis. really thin surfaces. mine and hollys were destroyed before they were even broke in. hollys before she even used em.
lavers: bad for my body... but good surfaces. they were like bricks. no flex, and no support.
climas....
man i love climas. they feel so nice on my feet. they get rancid stank everytime i wear them. thats from no socks.
i think they compress, but if you play on your toes like your supposed to, then i think youd be alright. (not pointing fingers, just a statement). used climas are worse for this, because you didnt start the compression, so its advanced before you can mold them to footbag goodness. plus, theyd compress for running, not foobag.
i also think your ability to mod definetly hinders the shoes potential for many. everyone has to learn somehow though...
just so long as i get two or three more pairs, i think ill be fine.
keep your lavers
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PegLegHolly
- Swashbuckler
- Posts: 2475
- Joined: 02 Aug 2006 17:43
- Location: Cleveland, OH
- Contact:
climas help prevent shin splints because of the arch support and the cushioning (someones going to tell me im wrong on that one). i personally love climas. i agree with henry that the toe isnt the best. it does improve your setting accuracy if you find out where the "sweet spot" is... but i wouldnt use them just for setting/stalling accuracy.Wasabi wrote:So wait, if I'm clear on this, Climas prevent shin splints because you're forced to crank your toes up to take advantage of the huge toe area? I think that's silly, since it's a form issue. And wouldn't having a small toe box make your accuracy in toe sets a little better?
when i wear my goonits, the toe box is really small because i have small feet. i wear size 6.5 mens and brian wears 9 and his toe box on his goonits are twice the size of mine. climas give me more room on my toe than goonits and lavers.
i saw that someone said climas are hard to mod. i disagree. i absolutely love modding climas! its definately a lot more work than laver mods and goonit mods... but climas seem to have more character to their mods. im probably biased on this though because ive modded all mine and brians climas (nearly 12 total). i guess i like the tecnical aspect of clima mods.
after playing in climas and switching to goonits every few sessions... i always feel like im cheating with clipper pockets and toe pockets on goonits. to me, its like playing with gutter guards in bowling. dont get me wrong though... gunits are pretty rad. i have a pair of units that ripped the day i modded them... and it was from the inferior mesh. i had just spent 50 bucks on a pair of shoes and.... blah blah blah.
i love climas... but i love goonits too.
Holly Mathews
peglegholly.com
peglegholly.com
i've only ever once played in climas for 5 minutes so i can't comment on their performance. however my bias agains climacools has always been the stance/style of play that goes along with them.
it might be easier to perform certain moves in the climas, but overall i do not like the general style players that use climas develope. if you watch old felix zenger footage from around 2003 (in climas) and compare it with stuff from 2004 or later (when he switched back to lavers for exactly this reason) you'll notice a huge difference in form. personally i think it was a change for the better. but of course that's just my personal feeling/opinion.
it might be easier to perform certain moves in the climas, but overall i do not like the general style players that use climas develope. if you watch old felix zenger footage from around 2003 (in climas) and compare it with stuff from 2004 or later (when he switched back to lavers for exactly this reason) you'll notice a huge difference in form. personally i think it was a change for the better. but of course that's just my personal feeling/opinion.
I have the EXACT opposite opinion.
I'm stoked to play in Climas because I want my style to look like players like Andrew Grant and Ben Roscoe (I actually can't think of other players at the moment, but I know there are lots in Climas like I like...like Mikko Lepisto...though his style is awesome in a very different way). Players' styles that I've seen playing in Climacools rival that of almost any others (in my opinion, of course...)
I'm excited to be awesome and light-footed.
I'm stoked to play in Climas because I want my style to look like players like Andrew Grant and Ben Roscoe (I actually can't think of other players at the moment, but I know there are lots in Climas like I like...like Mikko Lepisto...though his style is awesome in a very different way). Players' styles that I've seen playing in Climacools rival that of almost any others (in my opinion, of course...)
I'm excited to be awesome and light-footed.
I got my Climas in the mail yesterday. Here are some initial thoughts I've had (before any real attempt at serious shred), from someone who has never worn Climacools before:
Climacool thoughts:
I just got my two pairs of Climacools in the mail
I am soooo happy that they fit right. I got a whole size down, like people suggested. Here are my first thoughts:
-scared of twisting my ankle
-toe is a lot better than Andrew said it would be at first
-plastic things on the inside are a PAIN, and it seems like a huge, scary mod process
-they're quite light
I did play for about 20 minutes, but was restricted by bad shin splints. I noticed that my osii are different -- flip was better, and good was really inconsistent. I guess this says that I need to change my form on clipper a bit, unless I take off that plastic stuff.
The only player I liked better in Climas than in lavers was felix. The shoes really made his crank stick out and i just thought he looked badass in them. As for other plays I'm not really sure. I like Matt's style a little more in lavers. Maybe Grant's is better in Climas, not enough footage to tell.
Anyway, I have these shoes and I don't really like them. Granted I haven't modded them but they are just too narrow for me. I guess I just like shoes that feel like boxes or something.
Maybe my opinion would change if mine were tighter and modded. I'm not sure.
dc
Anyway, I have these shoes and I don't really like them. Granted I haven't modded them but they are just too narrow for me. I guess I just like shoes that feel like boxes or something.
Maybe my opinion would change if mine were tighter and modded. I'm not sure.
dc
david
i like matt's style in lavers better as well. The surfaces on lavers are more consistent, but a little harder to catch on, which leads to using better, more conservative form and more precise sets in the clipper department.
climas are a good shoe, my ankles just happen to be a little too prone to falling over and injuring me.
climas are a good shoe, my ankles just happen to be a little too prone to falling over and injuring me.
BRICK!
rfa::never give up::
nyfa
rfa::never give up::
nyfa