The Big Move from Modified to Footbag.org Part 2 The Unlock

Guydro · Post by **Guydro** » 24 Sep 2008 15:41

I liked all the good reading until the personal attacks. More?

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 24 Sep 2008 17:32

Given the significance of this, perhaps mods could just delete and or ban any trolls and people who respond to trolls, rather than locking the topic.

That said, my understanding was that we're mainly waiting for Steve and/or the other people driving this project to put forward a more solid proposal. However I'm sure it's an issue people still want to express opinions on.

mc · Post by mc » 24 Sep 2008 17:37

Well,

here's where I'm at.

I am all for hosting modified on footbag.org. Basically, the situation is that it is saved externally to either of it's current hosts, and if, for some reason, things don't work out at .org, we'll have a backup and we can start it up somewhere else.

I am less inclined to combine the forums after seeing all the discussion that happened in that last thread.

I think Phase I is a great idea, and will get footbag off the back of modevia.

I gotta say, I'm pretty sad about how that last discussion got, in more than one respect (not just how it ended).

Guydro · Post by **Guydro** » 24 Sep 2008 18:06

The reason I found modified was because I was looking for good "Player Stitched Footbags". I never found that on .org. What I found there was Matt Cross telling everyone to look at the "stitcher listing" on Modified.in. That is why I found and love this place. I love buying new footbags when I can. I have a bad footbag habit I'm trying to kick. So until then I would like to see a "for sell" category on .org. Will that still be the case?

edit: P.S. I edit because I can't spell.....................................Please don't take that away!!!

Eric Chang · Post by **Eric Chang** » 24 Sep 2008 19:34

I did not want to post in this forum for a long time, as I have been choosing to stay away from any "serious" discussion but there are a few things I want to address.

Matt what are you talking about? You mean if a few people are against your idea you just give up?

Also why are people being such dicks about this? People are trying to centralize our small sport, and a few people are saying this is a bad idea?

Because that we can't edit our posts? No blogs? No for sale section?

I swear that people can be pretty stupid sometimes. Do you people grasp that NOTHING has been finalized yet? That Matt and Steve have not given an ultimatum saying "Screw you modified you have to do it our way or the highway". The fact that they asked feedback should be a light bulb on your head.

If enough people wanted PMs, Editing, etc. Steve, Matt, and who ever else working on the project would probably say "why not"

Another thing of the whole "information" B.S. face it. Who would want to get your information to use for money? Steve is rich as it is, he doesn't need your money. (But I will take donations) Come on Matt and who ever else (sorry don't know everyone working the project) are taking time to help out when they could probably be making money.

But I realize and here is the kicker. NOTHING has been finalized yet NOTHING! Its only a proposal that is subject to change!

I fully support this but as feedback, I would like to keep the various functions during the switch.

-Editing: Is very important for me, especially in my video where I post routines that I have recorded. So that means I need to update the page when I start getting more routines in. It also helps because I might have posted a dead link, and need to change it. Frankly I can ask a moderator to do it, but I am up late at night and need it done now (especially if its a video project)

-Private Messaging: Is a cool feature to have since it works like another email. I think people like it, but for me it doesn't matter since I always check my email before modified. Not to mention I check my emails plenty of times a day (thank you gmail notifier :-p).

-As for forum topics, people should read that everything is being copied over) So yes guydro, odds are the for sale section is going to be transferred over. I highly suggest reading through the proposal that they have been throwing out there.

Matt once again, its three or four people who usually "discuss" a topic. Keep pushing this, and ignore people with nothing good to add to this.

LEGOMAN · Post by **LEGOMAN** » 24 Sep 2008 19:58

Jeremy wrote:Given the significance of this, perhaps mods could just delete and or ban any trolls and people who respond to trolls, rather than locking the topic.

Weren't you a mod Jeremy? I'm almost 100 percent sure they cannot ban users.

Also I want to throw out my opinion on server change.

I like the idea of making all the forums footbag hosted on one server. It does take all the stress off of the people who are hosting this website for free currently, but what's the point of it so far? I feel that if Steve and the rest of footbag.org is willing to host modified on their servers, that we need to fix everything else is wrong with modified.

I am all of the switch to the footbag.org servers, I just wish that we would fix modified at the same time.

Hopefully I didn't go too off topic?

EDIT: High five Eric! Good post!

EDIT 2: If it seems I was attacking Jeremy, I wasn't meaning to. I just want to confirm or know the real truth of what I think I know.

mc · Post by mc » 24 Sep 2008 20:21

Saying you want to fix all the problems with modified is like saying you want to fix all the problems with humanity.

it's an inherently flawed thing, there are going to be problems. as long as there are people who think they can accomplish what they want or get what they desire through negativity (which is forever), the problems are going to perpetuate.

The best thing you can do is set a good example (not saying that I've always done this). Make positive posts. Increase the percentage of goodness on the forum, instead of increasing the negativity, either by complaining about everyone else, or literally increasing the negativity to exemplify it

dyalander · Post by **dyalander** » 24 Sep 2008 20:35

While I totally agree with Matt, I think there is clearly room for the mods to improve as well and we're looking into ways to do it - Jeremy's suggestion above is something we'll discuss - it makes sense, and I think its an approach that will clean up the forums quite a bit.

I think moving things to footbag.org will help because there'll be more mods about, and since three of the five active mods go by Sydney time, it takes a while for things to get picked up and by then its often too late - and we also simply haven't been active enough in some respects. Having a significantly larger mod team will help with this. But it won't just magically fix everything and Kyle's right, we do need to make other improvements.

In the meantime lets keep this thread on topic and not make the same mistakes as the were made the first time 'round.

LEGOMAN · Post by **LEGOMAN** » 24 Sep 2008 20:53

There is a point to this move, and in my last post it seems like I don't think there is one. It's a really good thing to have all footbag related things hosted on the same server, but the point of this will be moot if modified isn't fixed.

(maybe i got my point across this time)

King Monkey · Post by **King Monkey** » 25 Sep 2008 00:07

I think the idea has been abandoned now hasnt it?

Oh and its very possible for Mods to ban users, given that it is appropriate.

habitat · Post by **habitat** » 25 Sep 2008 05:42

Jeremy wrote:Given the significance of this, perhaps mods could just delete and or ban any trolls and people who respond to trolls, rather than locking the topic..

I can't believe it's not butter!

Sergey · Post by **Sergey** » 25 Sep 2008 07:09

Jeremy wrote:Given the significance of this, perhaps mods could just delete and or ban any trolls and people who respond to trolls, rather than locking the topic.

I agree. Banning a user for a week or so would be rather therapeutic. If you can't behave on an internet forum, you are not a decent person in my opinion.

Matt Cross wrote: The best thing you can do is set a good example (not saying that I've always done this). Make positive posts. Increase the percentage of goodness on the forum, instead of increasing the negativity, either by complaining about everyone else, or literally increasing the negativity to exemplify it.

+1000

I fully support moving to footbag.org

I have a question: Would the forum change much if the changes took place? Any new features would be available? For instance: improved post editing, (+/-) reputation, new emotions? If I'm asking questions that have been already addressed, I apologize. Thanks in advance.

mc · Post by mc » 25 Sep 2008 07:39

King Monkey wrote:I think the idea has been abandoned now hasnt it?

i'm interested in knowing what you're basing that on.

I spoke to steve a few days ago, and he's still on.

the thing I'm stuck on is that we have some really, really unproductive input coming in from both sides of the table, and I'm not sure how to deal with that.

I just woke up, more later.

Brian · Post by **Brian** » 25 Sep 2008 10:24

I didn't respond to the last thread because I was slightly confused with the context of what would potentially take place. At any rate, I am indifferent as to what forum is used, so long as we do have a forum to discuss the sport. It would make sense to have the more popular forum directly on footbag.org though, instead of the way it is now on a web address titled "Modified". When a new player is getting into the game and posts on footbag.org with little response (I don't know if this is the case, as I don't view the footbag.org forums), it could give them the impression that the sport is not very active and be the difference between them joining the community or quickly loosing interest. In that sense it would be benificial if the majority of the community were posting on footbag.org instead of being somewhat hidden as the case is now on modified.in.

Those are my thoughts anyways.

King Monkey · Post by **King Monkey** » 25 Sep 2008 19:27

Matt Cross wrote: I spoke to steve a few days ago, and he's still on.

Sorry, things must have changed since the last info i got. Just didnt want us to be flogging a dead horse here if the idea had indeed been abandoned.

Go about your business!

Blue_turnip · Post by **Blue_turnip** » 26 Sep 2008 01:44

Brian wrote:I didn't respond to the last thread because I was slightly confused with the context of what would potentially take place. At any rate, I am indifferent as to what forum is used, so long as we do have a forum to discuss the sport. It would make sense to have the more popular forum directly on footbag.org though, instead of the way it is now on a web address titled "Modified". When a new player is getting into the game and posts on footbag.org with little response (I don't know if this is the case, as I don't view the footbag.org forums), it could give them the impression that the sport is not very active and be the difference between them joining the community or quickly loosing interest. In that sense it would be benificial if the majority of the community were posting on footbag.org instead of being somewhat hidden as the case is now on modified.in.

Those are my thoughts anyways.

Too true. There's nothing worse than the vibes a dead forum emit.

mc · Post by mc » 02 Oct 2008 11:50

So,

Just thought I'd update you folks on what I'm thinking about this, considering that I kinda got the ball rolling on this whole deal.

I don't think Modified + Footbag.org is going to work.

Basically, the one guy that we need to work with to make it work is a very sensitive individual with very strong opinions about how things should and shouldn't be done, and consequently, he doesn't have very much respect for opinions that don't align with his own.

Contradictory opinions lead to disagreement, and disagreement without respect for the other party's P.O.V. lead to fighting and insults, and when the person you need to work with refuses to cooperate in the presence of fighting, insults, and negative opinions directed at or concerned with him, everything stops.

So, basically, I see a situation in which it's guaranteed that there's going to be constant conflict between prevalent discussion participants and the guy with all the control over the situation.

This was the problem I saw a few years ago when this last came up, and I thought that since .org had had a few years to develop, maybe this situation wouldn't be as bad.

However, when I saw the guy's response to disagreement with his ideals in the last big thread I started, it really made it clear to me that those who feel strongly about how modified is run are not going to ever really line up with him.

I'm considering a fundraising project so we can at least start paying modevia for the costs we're incurring upon them. It would only take a few dollars a month from a few of the regular participants. But that's a discussion for another thread.

Any thoughts?

Tsiangkun · Post by **Tsiangkun** » 02 Oct 2008 12:09

I'll donate $200 to hosting costs, set up a paypal link.

I think that will cover 4-10 months, maybe more, but I don't really know the site traffic stats, or hosting rates they would charge.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 07 Oct 2008 14:08

There is no reason why we can't do "phase 1" and have modified and the footbag.org forum hosted separately on footbag.org. Modified would be run in exactly the same manner, and look exactly the same.

mc · Post by mc » 07 Oct 2008 14:44

well, there is one thing that stops us from doing it,

that being that the person we need to actually "do it" has a tendency to cease cooperation and disinvolve himself from the situation in the presence of opinions that counter his own.

last I spoke to steve, he had stopped showing any positivity regarding this project, and he told me that he would get to it when he's able to "prioritize it in terms of the 40 other things" he's working on.