Life without buterfly/whirl/dod

BalinorNZ · Post by **BalinorNZ** » 29 May 2004 16:32

Butterfly and whirl and dod moves are used very widely by every footbagger (i cannot think of a footbag player who does not do whirls/butteflys/dod type moves in their runs.

My questoin is, firstly can YOU think of any player who does not do those moves, or atleast not often (most ppl seem to have 50%+ of their runs based on those moves) and what do you think the result of not doing those types of moves would be?

I mean i guess they all work certain mustle groups and give a unique type of flexability and co-ordination you cant really get from another move, and those skills from schooling those moves may effect other areas of ones game.

What do you think?

bigdirtyfoot · Post by **bigdirtyfoot** » 29 May 2004 16:45

Chris Pinkus.

...

The result is that he's very quick and agile, and that he has an awesome style.

NotHisRealName · Post by **NotHisRealName** » 29 May 2004 22:15

I was thinking of Chris too.

BalinorNZ · Post by **BalinorNZ** » 30 May 2004 01:07

Why does he not do those moves? Ill have to see if i can find some of his vids, i have the one of his warp or wateva he called it

kaos · Post by **kaos** » 30 May 2004 01:39

This gallery has a lot of videos with some crazy Pinkus shred. If you don't have them already, download the "Summer Falling" series, Above Influence, and well, everything else...

Caleb · Post by **Caleb** » 30 May 2004 06:51

he started out mad quick because he's a judo master. and he doesn't do the typical freestyle moves because for years he's been too lazy to skool his clippers. haha. so if you're trying to shred like the rest of us, and with the disadvantage of going toe guiltless, things are bound to get pretty crazy after some practice.

put all that together and you get a type of freestyler the world has never seen before.

jhibbs · Post by **jhibbs** » 30 May 2004 09:12

Did you mean no clippers at all, or just without those moves? I imagine a pretty interesting style could come from using alot of drifters and ducking/spinning with clipper/osis moves added onto the toe moves and clipe>toe moves

Laroche · Post by **Laroche** » 30 May 2004 16:52

Jon Shnieder.. `Nuff said

Outsider · Post by **Outsider** » 30 May 2004 19:50

Thanks, Nick,

But I don't care to think of myself as an example yet... I've been highly dependant on butterflies for a long time, and I've taken great pride in my whirling moves ( but I just never felt comfortable with the paradox whirl). Double Butterfly type tricks have alwasy been sorely lacking from my game, and I regret this, but I've written them off and won't look back.

However, I want to address the topic as a whole:

My questoin is, firstly can YOU think of any player who does not do those moves (Butterfly and whirl and dod moves ), or atleast not often (most ppl seem to have 50%+ of their runs based on those moves) and what do you think the result of not doing those types of moves would be?

...and suggest an alternate question instead: Can you imagine freestyle footbag without clipper and toe stalls? At least, freestyle with less than 50% cross-body-inside and toe delays...

But I don't care to think of myself as an example yet...

My goal now is to become this example. Just don't expect to see much yet, as I am a very patient practioner of the freestyle arts...

Jeez, my ego is getting a little out of control now. I mean, just look, I'm quoting myself in this post from the very same post. I need Worlds to get here quick so I can get spanked around a bunch and get my ass brought back down to earth. Please, don't anyone else say any more nice things about me (Nick LaRoche Kicks ASS!)

BalinorNZ · Post by **BalinorNZ** » 30 May 2004 20:50

Thanks for that link Kaos. It will come in handy.

Ok ill direct my iquiery more now.

The reason i dont want to do butterfly/whirl/dod/whirr type moves is becuase they are the moves that have the jobs "set>dex>opclip" where the set can be any type and the dex can be any type. Doing moves like this have proven very bad for my ankles as i have quite weak ankles and ive injured them several times, the last time ripping tendons and ligiements quite sevearly.
I do want to continue with footbag, but i cannot continue to do those moves.

Could you please post any toe to clipper or clipper to clipper moves you can think of that i could use to replace butterfly/whirl/dod? All i can think of is drifter&grifter or royale/torque(whats reverse torque called?)/swirl&reverse swirl/dyno&blender and ofcousre osis.

I can do atomic/spinning/ducking/stepping(needs work) sets so im not too limited, and ofcousre there are always plenty of great toe to toe and clip to toe moves.

What do you all think, does anyone have a style that does not use those ankle breaking moves at all? Or will i be the first? hehe, perhaps not the first failure though, only time will tell.

Outsider · Post by **Outsider** » 30 May 2004 21:31

Skool Ducks and Dives. They are still cool without any dexes on the end.

Spinning Clipper > Ducking Clipper > Spinning Clipper > Ducking Clipper.
Ducking Clipper > Diving Clipper > Ducking Clipper > Diving Clipper.
Diving Mirage.
Ducking Paradox Mirage.
Diving Osis.
Spinning Ducking Clipper.

These moves and combos barely even begin to scratch the surface of the potential uses of ducks and dives, which, by the way, I think link easily with osis. I especially like the way Sticky Ricky Moran is using spinning ducking paradox mirage and stuff like that. Lots of cool stuff is possible.

I am sorry to hear that whirls and such have caused you such pain. However, I am COMPETELY CERTAIN that STRONG freestyle is still possible without those moves that you are trying to avoid. It will take lots of practice, but then, whirls and double-over-downs do too (and so does everything else). Good luck.

Outsider · Post by **Outsider** » 30 May 2004 21:33

By the way, Balinor,

I thought your initial post was just a hypothetical question. I didn't realize what you were really getting after.

By-the-way part 2,

reverse-dexing torque is called Flux.

BalinorNZ · Post by **BalinorNZ** » 31 May 2004 13:19

Ducks and dives are pretty cool, before i did my ankle i was getting into far symp ducking reverse whirls, wont be doing many more of them though.

I guess there is still the potential for some big moves if i can hit osis and dyno or blender consistantly off a duck and after some schooling adding a spinning or atomic/stepping set in front could form quite a compeditive sick 3.

I dont think there are any other toe to clip or clip to clip moves then blender(dyno)/torque(flux)/swirl(rev swirl)/osis/drifter(grifter) (by this i mean base moves with no sets applied) oh apart from mabey dada curve? Lol.

Thanks for your help guys.

ebo · Post by **ebo** » 31 May 2004 16:07

Yves Kreil doesn't do any whirls afaik.

i understand a whirl or a dod can be tough on your ankles, but a butterfly?
it's just a step really, and if done properly, should be less harm on your
ankles than a legover or a mirage.

BalinorNZ · Post by **BalinorNZ** » 31 May 2004 18:56

Its the whole concept of landing on the foot after doing a dex when the foot is coming down from the outside of the body i think, i seem to tilt my feet inward when doing the dex and landing on the side and it snapping is the result.
It has happened once with butterfly, i was however far to close to a wall and didnt want to end my run, i was thinking more about the wall then the landing evidently though and my ankle bore the punishment

.
I think butterflies wouldent be such a problem generally if i schooled them a bit more, but to minimise risk im ruleing them out too.
It really sucks having this injury, not only does it hurt like a bitch, but ive got time now while the rest of the crew is having a break from footbag for various reasons to catch up to them, and now i cant, the inability to play is quite frustrating.

Tsiangkun · Post by **Tsiangkun** » 01 Jun 2004 14:29

Why would we have to imagine a world without these tricks, when it already exists.

Check out these sweet trix.

FlexThis · Post by **FlexThis** » 01 Jun 2004 15:03

bigdirtyfoot · Post by **bigdirtyfoot** » 01 Jun 2004 15:22

Man I think I might get Tsunami Death Served. Naw, but I mean, let them have their fun...

I thought it was extra funny that a few years ago I submitted something to that site just to get a 122 panel footbag... which of course, is a bit rolly, although I was fully expecting that. I still haven't figured out what to do with it.

Tsiangkun · Post by **Tsiangkun** » 01 Jun 2004 15:32

I have a new trick, I call it the George W. Bush.

You stand in the circle talking shit about everyone's game, except your own.
When the bag comes to you, and everyone is watching, kick the bag a few times like you are getting ready to really show them something, then drop the hack and walk away.

ebo · Post by **ebo** » 01 Jun 2004 15:32

Eat this, Vaska!!! Spinning Rainbow Jester Stall!!!!