Pixies and Fairys

Shaun · Post by **Shaun** » 07 Jul 2004 16:18

Ok I was looking at some of the pixie and fairy clips on monsterhack. And I was wondering is the dex for both of these done on the uptime or downtime? Cause I read that when you pixie set it is uptime but when you just pixie its downtime. Same went for fairy,but when I watched the fairy video the dex was on the uptime. Anyone care to tell it straight?

sampotter · Post by **sampotter** » 07 Jul 2004 16:36

The same applies to both -

pixie set = a set, hence uptime
fairy set = a set, hence uptime
pixie = a move, hence downtime
fairy = a move, hence downtime

Shaun · Post by **Shaun** » 07 Jul 2004 17:00

Alright,thanks.

FlexThis · Post by **FlexThis** » 08 Jul 2004 07:45

sampotter · Post by **sampotter** » 08 Jul 2004 11:19

I think I remember this conversation being had somewhere, and I think it ultimately came down to technical interpretation.

Also, aren't pixies and fairies (done as moves) really -muted- ss mirages and illusions? As I don't consider them pixies and fairies done with a plant.

Shaun · Post by **Shaun** » 08 Jul 2004 15:35

FlexThis wrote:That's incorrect. A pixie and a fairy are not moves in and of themselves.

A pixie is an uptime dexing set into something else, same for fairy. Done by its self all uptime would be a pixie or fairy toe stall.

A pixie done downtime is simply a Same Side mirage, and a fairy done downtime is a Same Side illusion. I have seen a lot of video that portrays these 2 sets WRONG.

If you re-read the video link for a fairy, it says fairy toe stall. That particular fairy is questionable because he completes the dex as the bag is falling. There is more than one way to hit that move. Jason Crook is a prime example of someone who hits a consistant fairy set. The bag actually gets dexed at the hip as opposed to the lower leg. But that is a style choice not a given.

So your saying that there is no such thing as a pixie or fairy? They are just sets.

ebo · Post by **ebo** » 09 Jul 2004 06:30

as for pixies and fairies done downtime, I either refer to them as
"ss mirage/ss illusion" or "downtime pixie/downtime fairy".

we could also start calling pixie/fairy sets ATW-sets...

FlexThis · Post by **FlexThis** » 09 Jul 2004 07:51

sampotter · Post by **sampotter** » 09 Jul 2004 08:33

I really have to disagree.

I'm quite capable of determining whether or not a bag is going uptime or downtime, but I've seen cases that are really not in either category.

When I leanred both moves (as well as most people I shred with in Seattle), we learned them as around the worlds bailed to op toe, and called them pixies and fairies. For example, "Oh, I hit mirage>pixie>repeat!" or whatever. I did NOT learn them like mirages and illusions bailed to op toe (maybe fairies I did, but only because I was worse at those and took me longer to learn). There was a distinct difference in motion. They looked like someone doing an around the world and bailing. It wasn't just a similarity in jobs. When people did these it was as if they were inbetween uptime and downtime, a lot like legovers done with a hop. Just a stepping stone until you learn them the technically corrent way.

As for pixie legover, I've seen plenty of people learn this move similarly, all in one hop. There isn't a wait, and there isn't a distinct hop. It's like doing the pixie atw bail deal to a legover. As Justin was demonstrating to me once time, you can do it with a foot high set if you really want to (but didn't advise) when you learn it, because of how you hit it.

So while I wouldn't call the pixie legover something different, I would call the muted ss mirages and muted ss illusions something different. Probably pixies and fairies, since that's what I and everyone else around here has always called them as far as I know.

FlexThis · Post by **FlexThis** » 09 Jul 2004 10:01

sampotter · Post by **sampotter** » 09 Jul 2004 10:38

These aren't the ways I do the moves, these are the ways I know people around me have been learning them, and the way people address them. From the very early days of my playing I've been playing with people like Justin Dale and Ricky Moran, so I'm very aware of the differences between these moves. I don't do pixie legovers thin and lazy like that, I do them distinctly uptime and downtime, the same with my legovers (no hop), and the same with ss mirages and ss illusions (a plant). But people around me do.

I wouldn't call mirages quantums or a quantum legover a miraging legover, it's just pixie and fairy seem to be the ones with this special case (fairy less so than pixie, as it seems fewer people initially learn fairy this way). I don't really have an argument aside from that I believe there's a distinction between "pixie" and ss mirage. That doesn't reflect my opinion as to how I think people should learn the moves. I personally believe people should NOT learn pixies and fairies, but instead mirages and illusions, then learn to hit them from any surface (ie. learning ss mirage/ss illusion, clipper set mirage/bubba, pdx mirage/pdx illusion, and of course mirage and illusion), then later learning pixie and fairy -sets- done hippy as to promote good technical habit and the foundation for shuffling. This way people aren't learning a lazy pixie legover and pixie ss clipper or dimwalk and then bitching when they can't hit magellan or parkwalk or, as you said, phoenix.

(also not acting snotty, just clarifying :-p)

FlexThis · Post by **FlexThis** » 09 Jul 2004 10:51

Then we agree technically. I agree with you about how people should learn tricks, and would support the idea that pixie can be a move, if so many BAP and historic players would agree. I do pixie toe stall as a warm up for other pixie set moves. I also do a pixie pixie no plant which is listed as a trick, so I can see your point. I do not call it a toe set SS barrage cause half of the move is uptime. The real question is - Are you having fun kicking? Then that's all that matters. Sorry for any arguments.

Oh and I mentioned that a spin is not a move. I must retract that statement a spin is a move in and of itself when done between kicks. My bad.

sampotter · Post by **sampotter** » 09 Jul 2004 11:40

FlexThis wrote:Sorry for any arguments.

No apology needed, as no offense was ever taken. It's always fun to debate about this kind of thing.

ebo · Post by **ebo** » 09 Jul 2004 12:57

While I agree with you Damon, that Pixie and Fairy should only
refer to the sets instead of labeling a ss mirage a downtime pixie, I did
hear the term 'downtime pixie' for ss mirage quite often. Personally,
I prefer to say ss mirage instead of pixie, but I didn't know if
downtime pixie was an official term or not.

Anz · Post by **Anz** » 09 Jul 2004 21:53

The difference between Pixie trick and ss Mirage is that you plant the dexing foot in ss Mirage and don't plant it in Pixie trick.

In op Mirage you always plant dexing foot (it would be weird without doing that) so for me it sounds right to plant also in ss Mirage.

When doing a Pixie set you don't plant. Therefore, when doing a downtime Pixie (Pixie trick) you also shouldn't plant, because it's just the set done downtime as a trick.

This way can be explained the difference between Terrage and Pixie ss Mirage.
In both tricks, the first dex should be done as (even a little in Terrage) a set.
Terrage is double Pixie because you don't plant between the dexes.
In Pixie ss Mirage there is a plant, so after the first dex and plant the second dex isn't a Pixie anymre due the planting - it's a Mirage.

This is how I see things.

- Anssi Sundberg

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 10 Jul 2004 04:28

interesting point, but what if you do a muted pixie ss mirage. So you do a clear up time pixie and a clear downtime mirage - but with no plant!

Also where does "Symposium Pixie" fit into people's arguements.

Anz · Post by **Anz** » 10 Jul 2004 04:59

Muted Pixie ss Mirage... It can be called Pixie ss Pixie (wich sounds strange) but also Muted Pixie ss Mirage. It is muted, as you said Jeremy, so both names fit.

Symposium Pixie... Well, all right, my first post didn't explain that. It's symposium, so ordinary Pixie defination doesn't fit for it - and doesn't have to. I would say that it can be called Symposium ss Mirage as well as Symposium Pixie.

sampotter · Post by **sampotter** » 10 Jul 2004 07:42

Symposium Pixie is just smp ss mirage.

comastalker · Post by **comastalker** » 15 Jul 2004 07:09

pixie IS a move. The one who logically refers from pixies to "gyros" doesn't know what logic means be defintion. If there should be no pixie, stepping also doesn't exists, it's clip set miraging. People just started naming different component links, because they fuckin didn't want to say "toe set muted ss mirage". You may all always say toe set muted ss mirage, but don't attack me if I say pixie, because then I'll always attack you, if you say torque. "That would logically mean there's a set called torquing". Start thinking about that naming difficulties and look into an encyclopedia what logic is.

ebo · Post by **ebo** » 21 Jul 2004 04:40

Pixie pixie and Fairy fairy would be the dumbest movenames in the sport
ever. Even worse than Leviathan's other name...

I think we can end this discussion because everybody obviously has
different views on what to call downtime pixies/fairies. If someone writes down a run like

janiwalker swirl>alpine blurry flurry>pixie>osis

then we can all assume that the pixie must've been a downtime move, i.e.
muted ss mirage. If it actually was uptime, he should've written "pixie toe"
or something.