Who is better at footbag, Jordan or Vasek?

Paulsator · Post by **Paulsator** » 11 Apr 2005 12:58

well, yves is pretty much the craziest shuffler ever(and by shuffling i mean blurry drifter>gravedigger>fog>smog>smoke>tombstone>blurrtorqueish runs) and other than that his game is also totally top notch. Also he is the only player who plays 95% genuine and he has consistently long and huge runs with lots of 5's and stupidly hard combos. he's insane. you'll see at footjam, gfo, euros or worlds.

B_Man · Post by **B_Man** » 11 Apr 2005 16:05

Matt Cross wrote:Now I hear about vasek showing up to sessions drunk and not playing well at Todexon for whatever reason... was he too drunk at that too? And now he says things like this? "question me? what? screw you people, I'm not making a video, who cares?"

Is this true? What are your sources? How do you know for sure?

I don't know why people are making a big deal about this - what does it matter if so-and-so is better than what's-his-name? NOTHING! It doesn't mean anything - we all play for one reason (atleast I should hope) and that's to enjoy it. How can you effectively judge who is better, anyways? Ales didn't make the top 5 from Worlds last year in routines, so does that make him a horrible player? Geeze, use your head people! We all know Ales is uber - he's the Man of Steel for rice sakes!

As someone / several people pointed out already, everyone has their strong points and weakpoints, so it is incredibly difficult to determine who is better than who. Jorden has creativity and unique tricks up the wazoo while Vasek is stock-piled with technical difficulty and consistancy.

For those who still don't get it, check this out:

We've all played pokemon, right? Honestly, I think a fuckload of us have (myself included

). Well everyone knows that no pokemon is in fact the most powerful pokemon - they all have their strengths and weaknesses. Charmander, the fire-type pokemon, is weak against Squirtle, the water type, who in turn is weak against Bulbasuar, the grass type. Charmander has a natural edge against Bulbasuar - fire burns plants - and thus we have a little circle where no one is clearly the strongest pokemon of those three.

Now Vasek can be compared to Mewtwo - an incredibly powerful Pyschic type pokemon who has unmatched strengths and abilities. His power is felt when he's on the scene and all pokemon cower before him!

HOWEVER

Mewtwo is a pyschic type pokemon, meaning that a right type of Bug pokemon has the natural edge over even this powerhouse. Jorden could very well be that bug, but it will take one crazy motha of a bug to bring the pyschic-type down. It's only a matter of time before Jorden "levels up and learns new TMs" before he has the opportunity to surpass Vasek - the pyschic type. Like a pokemon can only reach level 100 and be pumped up with so many drugs, a human can only exert so much before the force created on their legs give out. If (or when) this happens to Vasek, he'll still only be a pyschic type pokemon, meaning he has a weakness. Jorden (or ANYONE ELSE for that matter) may be strong in the area in which Vasek lacks. Bling blang, we have a veiner.

Then it's just a cycle until the next person is toppled.

On a final note, don't assume Vasek is arrogant since he holds footbag supremecy on our small, fragile community. Meet the guy first.

Now someone PLEASE show me some lovin for that kick-ass pokemon allusion

footjoe · Post by **footjoe** » 11 Apr 2005 16:19

that was such a good write about , the pokemon thing was perfect for it. I dont feel like giving my 2 cents on this topic because i think its usless and does nothing , but i still play pokemon occasionally , game boy color rocks

crazydwarf · Post by **crazydwarf** » 11 Apr 2005 16:37

Now Vasek can be compared to Mewtwo - an incredibly powerful Pyschic type pokemon who has unmatched strengths and abilities. His power is felt when he's on the scene and all pokemon cower before him!

My friend suggested that I add that like mewtwo vasek started out in a science lab as a science expirement, but then he got out of hand and broke free...

peanutbuterboy · Post by **peanutbuterboy** » 11 Apr 2005 16:51

B man you are a god. You put that perfectly.

...to bad I am goldeen.

Uranos · Post by **Uranos** » 11 Apr 2005 17:15

I thought Jorden would be Mew, because in the actual game its the most hard one to get and its pretty much as good as Mewtwo.

QuantumBalance · Post by **QuantumBalance** » 11 Apr 2005 17:38

whoa this topic blew up, i just wanted to see what you guys thought ... looks like vasek is winning by far! i did learn that jordan is 16 tho.. i predict he will eventually overtake vasek.. but lol i dunno

dang jordan, honza said ure over 50% vasek! Thats amazing! I'm like.. 4% vasek

peace and happiness all

david · Post by **david** » 11 Apr 2005 18:10

i beleive jorden is 17.

Jorden · Post by **Jorden** » 11 Apr 2005 19:37

Whoa. How did I not notice this thread until now?

Hey everyone,

I have to say I never expected a reaction anything like this. Hmm, where do I start?
My name's Jorden Moir (yes, with an 'e'), I'm 17 and started footbag 3 1/2 years ago. In the months before Worlds 2004, I schooled hard and it paid off. Squeaked into routine finals and was inducted into BAP. A great reward and motivator to improve further. I was in awe of the Golden Child then -- as I still am today.

About the session videos:

First off, I'd like to aplogise for perhaps "misrepresenting" myself in the videos. Of 2+ hours of filming for each vid, about 10 minutes is decent footage. That means, most of the time I am dropping on tons of short runs and single tricks. Sometimes variety can backfire -- so many different tricks and concepts to work on at once, so none of them get overly consistent. This is how I feel at this point in my game.

To all those who have been giving me props all along and sticking up for me, I give you endless thanks. Clearly Vasek is the better player. I feel bad for Honza for getting all this heat.

I will continue to push myself harder than ever, and spend less time making videos. Sorry if you wanted more footage. My original goal was to the best in the world someday, and I feel I have a good start. This player has a lot of work to do.

Someday.

Jorden

BalinorNZ · Post by **BalinorNZ** » 11 Apr 2005 21:11

Jorden is right.
I have been making videos recently and to be honest, when you make a video of yourself, you look alot better than you really are. Of course Jorden only puts his best runs and tricks in. You cant really judge someones consistancy from a video they have made of themselves.

Vasek however, has never made a video of himself. I think dexter made Bila Lavice?
I'm not saying that others making videos of Vasek does not make him look better than he probably is, just saying that if Vasek made a vid of himself, it would be alot more impressive than the scrapings which others capture of him at events.

Jorden, don't stop making videos man, they are great for the comunity, people seeing a great player hitting huge tricks get motivated, in some ways it is good for them to think your more consistant than you really are, because it drives them to meet that consistancy.

As for Matt Cross's comments on Ryan and Vasek's personaly habits as far as drinking and drug use goes, those where completely uncalled for. What Vasek and Ryan do in their spare time is no concern of ours and we should not judge them on this.
A players personal life is no concern of ours, only the strings we see him hit are for our judgement. I would rather not the footbag comunity become like the paperatzi.

Nic Bathgate
New Zealand
DFC

ebo · Post by **ebo** » 11 Apr 2005 23:41

don't want to sound too harsh, but everybody who has judged Vasek
by what others said about him in WRITTEN form (which can be taken
that way or that way, and this time it went a bit overboard) should
really grow up. Never judge anyone before you haven't met him in person.
I've met Vasek a couple of times, and he's such a friendly and down-to-earth
and introverted person. Matt, you shouldn't interpret too much into the
written word. Honza explained himself already anyway (and how he was
trying to sound).

That's all i have to say concerning this topic.

Just call me hagesy · Post by **Just call me hagesy** » 11 Apr 2005 23:53

I like alcohol, I like drugs, I love footbag. What more could you ask for.

ShredOnLawn · Post by **ShredOnLawn** » 11 Apr 2005 23:59

Almost everyone in the world is too drunk to hack sometimes. It's very enjoyable and it relaxes your muscles which is good for stretching.

Maybe Vasek getting too drunk to play well isn't a good way to stay the best in the world.

But since he is the best maybe one should consider the possibility that if he didn't get drunk he wouldn't be nearly as good.

Food for Thought=Drugs do different things to different people.

ENJOY LIFE, BE ALL YOU CAN, DO ALL YOU WANT

dex-ter · Post by **dex-ter** » 12 Apr 2005 00:02

))) to this whole topic and posts

Anz · Post by **Anz** » 12 Apr 2005 05:09

[EDIT] Argh, whatever.

mc · Post by mc » 12 Apr 2005 05:16

To Byrin, I got my info from Honza. In other Jorden threads, this topic has been brought up, and Honza said that Vasek showed up drunk to a demo and hit dod swirl > symp whirling swirl > symp flurry <rpt> or something like that. In another Jorden thread, or maybe a different post in the same thread, Honza said Vasek was too partied out at ToDexOn, and he hopes that footage doesn't come out so people don't think that's how Vasek plays (which seems a little off to me because... that's how he was playing).

So. There ya go. Read some recent Jorden threads, and you'll get the same info as me. Also, partying pretty hard is kind of part of his reputation.

Sorry if my comments came off as too critical. The point I was trying to make was that attitude is a big determinant in the direction of your footbag career (as exemplified by Ryan Mulroney).

Also like Ryan M, people are saying vasek is the best and no one will beat him and his skill and ability are unchallenged, etc etc etc.

When you show up to sessions drunk, and say things like "I don't care what you all (the footbag community) think" and "I'm not going to make some stupid video", don't you guys agree that that reflects badly upon your attitude as The Best Player in the World? The tone of those statements come across like a pouting kid to me. My observation has been chastised. Does anyone want to tell me how I *should* be interpreting words like "don't care" and "stupid video"? They seem pretty direct to me. No poetry there.

The only point I was trying to make with all that (definitely not a criticism of the party life... anyone who knows me knows that would be hypocritical) is that vasek is not as undefeatable as he may seem. His technical skills are unrivalled right now, but I think it's going to be a shorter time than some of you think until that changes, and his attitude towards the sport is going to be a major determining factor of how long he's on top.

This is totally not a personal thing with Vasek. I think he's great. i think he's a cool kid, and I liked hanging around with him at worlds. He also happens to be the best player in the sport, and that makes him a huge part of our world, so from time to time, he's going to be discussed as a concept (The Best Footbag Player) and not as a party kid from Prague. The issue I was taking wasn't with Vasek himself, but rather with the accepted perception of him and how that perception fits into the sport. That continues to be the case.

But, hey, that's really cool that he doesn't care about being the best. I guess it goes to show you, if you want to be the best, it isn't always about wanting to be the best. You have to just love it so much that being the best is secondary, and you just care about playing that much... But then, on the other hand, if he doesn't have that fire in his belly any more, he's going to get overshadowed by someone who does. Just like he did to Ryan. On the personal level, I'm glad he just loves to play and does what he wants. I'm just curious to see what happens at worlds.

I hope this thread doesn't piss Vasek off. Once again, to me, this isn't about him, it's about our perception of The Best Player in the World. I just look forward to playing some kicky bag with him and having a puff at Euros.

ebo · Post by **ebo** » 12 Apr 2005 05:25

Matt Cross wrote:When you show up to sessions drunk, and say things like "I don't care what you all (the footbag community) think" and "I'm not going to make some stupid video", don't you guys agree that that reflects badly upon your attitude as The Best Player in the World?

Matt, did you read at all what Honza wrote? (sorry if I speak for you, Honza)

Read again:

Webslinger wrote:What Vašek said means that he is not keen on beeing the best. And I think that everybody knows that he has no idea how to make videos, he has no video camera, not so good computer to make videos and so on... and it is not Vašek's style to ask people to do something for him....

let's move on now.

mc · Post by mc » 12 Apr 2005 05:59

Webslinger wrote:Well.....I told Vašek about all this and he said that he was not gonna make any stupid video and that he doesn't care about what do you guys think.

ebo wrote:did you read at all what Honza wrote?

don't roll your eyes at me and tell me to move on. If you don't want to be involved in the discussion, you know what to do.

I'm marginally sorry for being snipey. But seriously. I'm not misquoting anyone. and I find this discussion interesting, so you'll excuse me if I'm interested in continuing the discussion about what makes a champion, who is a champion, the responsibilities (or lack thereof) of a champion to the community, the responsibilities of the community in regards to the privacy / personal life of our champion, etc etc.

edit:

Webslinger wrote:What Vašek said means that he is not keen on beeing the best. And I think that everybody knows that he has no idea how to make videos, he has no video camera, not so good computer to make videos and so on... and it is not Vašek's style to ask people to do something for him....

if this statement is your reasoning for why I should drop it, please tell me how it is that this and the above quote mean the same thing?

grek · Post by **grek** » 12 Apr 2005 06:34

Dexter is kinda right...

Slippur · Post by **Slippur** » 12 Apr 2005 07:22

"Vasek doesn't care what do you guys think" and "Vasek isn't keen on being the best".. It seems pretty obvious how these could mean the same thing, it sounds like Vasek plays 7 hours a day because he loves to play footbag, and not because he wants everybody in the world to think he's the best.

Matt's argument about the quotes "not going to make a stupid video" and "he doesn't know how nor have capabilities to make the video" is a little more valid, but based on stories about Vasek I've ready in footblogs, I tend to think that Vasek didn't have the "tone" Matt's referring to, and certainly wasn't being a "pouting kid."

Also, I don't think it's fair to Vasek to quote snippets from Czech-to-English translations from friends that were at sessions and use them to make him sound like a party-animal elitist.

modified

Who is better at footbag, Jordan or Vasek?

Who is better, Jordan or Vasek? (Interpret however u want)