Ankle Sprains?
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SandWraith
- Egyptian Footgod
- Posts: 1272
- Joined: 05 Apr 2005 20:39
- Location: Marshfield, Wisconsin
Ankle Sprains?
So I sprained my ankle yesterday, and was thinking how that's something I would imagine a LOT of people have done at one point or another. Just curious about the actual numbers....
Zach Marine - Member of the Tendonitis Club!
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SandWraith
- Egyptian Footgod
- Posts: 1272
- Joined: 05 Apr 2005 20:39
- Location: Marshfield, Wisconsin
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mosher
- brutal footbag cronie
- Posts: 6177
- Joined: 22 Jan 2004 23:30
- Location: Toronto, Ontario
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I have twisted both of my ankles a few times from footbag now.
It is one of the things I fear most in life. Well.. really I fear any injury.. or "thing" that would prevent me from playing footbag.
It's so terrible because it automatically makes one clipper feel WAY weaker than the other.
I am still working out the feeling of my twist from just before new years.
Surprisingly (sorta) the one that I am healing has now passed the other in crankability. Derrick was flippin' out yesterday when he saw my ankle crank!
I am not sure how long it takes to heal them, just be really really careful when you play so that it never happens at all! Clean styles are probably way less condusive to twisted ankles.
I twisted my left foot twice doing a toe whirl. Those were the two most 'devistating' injuries of my footbag life so far. I have such horrible memories of my clipper foot catching my whirling heel and all my weight coming down on that one foot twisting it down into a forced frigidosis.
And then you get all scared when you hear the cracks as it cranks way beyond healthy.
Puke!!
What a sucky part of life.
I wish everyones ankles the best of luck!
It is one of the things I fear most in life. Well.. really I fear any injury.. or "thing" that would prevent me from playing footbag.
It's so terrible because it automatically makes one clipper feel WAY weaker than the other.
I am still working out the feeling of my twist from just before new years.
Surprisingly (sorta) the one that I am healing has now passed the other in crankability. Derrick was flippin' out yesterday when he saw my ankle crank!
I am not sure how long it takes to heal them, just be really really careful when you play so that it never happens at all! Clean styles are probably way less condusive to twisted ankles.
I twisted my left foot twice doing a toe whirl. Those were the two most 'devistating' injuries of my footbag life so far. I have such horrible memories of my clipper foot catching my whirling heel and all my weight coming down on that one foot twisting it down into a forced frigidosis.
And then you get all scared when you hear the cracks as it cranks way beyond healthy.Puke!!
What a sucky part of life.
I wish everyones ankles the best of luck!
Tom Mosher
hate is a waste of passion!
hate is a waste of passion!
Tom, how do you work on gettin your ankle better? I tried almost everything, and the feeling in my both ankles suck.
Pawel Ptaszynski
"I know I can! Be what I wanna be.
If I work hard at it, I'll be where I wanna be."
NAS
Be strong, LIVESTRONG
http://www.laf.org
http://www.wearyellow.com
"I know I can! Be what I wanna be.
If I work hard at it, I'll be where I wanna be."
NAS
Be strong, LIVESTRONG
http://www.laf.org
http://www.wearyellow.com
Take some time off from playing, sit down, point your toes, imagine you are holding a pencil with your foot, and write the alphabet everyday with both feet. That has helped me regain some strength and flexibility. Also, I have changed my game to reduce the chance that I will destroy my ankles again.
Theodore Anderson
I sprained both of my ankles during a period of a month , damn clima cools there support was alot different then the lavers i was used to , well anyway
I stayed off them for about 2 weeks apiece , obviosly that wasnt enough to heal them , But I was stubborn and didnt care and still shredded on them. I couldnt bend to stretch them or it hurt for about 2 months , then it got a little better and have just fully fully healed like 1 or 2 months ago , so I say heal it as much as you can or you will suffer from it later. ps . That sprain happened like last thanksgiving.
I stayed off them for about 2 weeks apiece , obviosly that wasnt enough to heal them , But I was stubborn and didnt care and still shredded on them. I couldnt bend to stretch them or it hurt for about 2 months , then it got a little better and have just fully fully healed like 1 or 2 months ago , so I say heal it as much as you can or you will suffer from it later. ps . That sprain happened like last thanksgiving.
15 year old Joe Kulacz
Interesting that you just bring sprained ankle up, I just wrote my rough draft about sprained ankles this morning after getting 1 hour of sleep and it does make sense. Before that draft I was up all night writing out 50 sources in MLA format for some english paper that was due 7:30 am this morning. Good times... OK , so it's mostly informational, but on my site you can see some exercises to strengthen the ankle.
L i n k
Also, yes, I have sprained my ankle. It was when I was learning barfly, I was exhausted, but Brad was pushing me to keep trying. Remember when you are exhausted and are trying difficult moves, you don't have the same body control like when you are freshly shredding, so be careful. I came down after dexing and heard a big ole 'crack'. I'm pretty sure it was a second degree sprain with some tearing of my lateral ligament, but I immediately took care of it. I was out for about 2 months. Then after that, I messed up my knee, and had knee surgery, so there was a couple more months.
Make sure like others said, to take your time getting back into things, I'll post my little write up on ankle sprains to give you all some ideas about how severe they can be, and what you should do. Sorry for the large write up, but hey, here is some info !
A large percentage of ankle injuries observed in outpatient physical therapy clinics are ankle sprains. These common ankle sprains are usually from some sort of sudden traumatic rolling of the ankle. With this roll, all force is then applied to one certain ligament that gives out, which causes stretching and tearing of the fibers that make up certain ligaments. Ankle sprains occur in just about all ages, but still fit into certain categories. Athletes are more prone to ankle sprains because of the constant exertion they put through there body which travels to the ankles. Some examples of athletes that are more liable to sprain there ankle are any athlete that is in a sport where there is fast pivoting such as; basketball, football, freestyle footbag, tennis, etc.
Another group that is more liable to sprain their ankle is the elderly or people that are deconditioned and/or overweight. The elderly usually don’t have the same proprioception as younger adults, therefore giving them more possibility to loose balance and sprain their ankle. The elderly are many times more deconditioned than normal adults, so their muscles and balance aren’t what they used to be. If you add on obesity, there is added weight to balance out on normal activities that have more potential to sprain your ankle such as; walking on hills, walking on bumpy terrain, etc.
These ligaments manage all of our body weight onto this crucial joint, so that is why ligament damage to the ankle is so common. A sprain can be described in three degrees of severity: 1. Microscopic tears in the ligament 2. more severe tear, but ligament is still attached. 3. Ligament is completely separated from tear.
Almost all ankle sprains are inversion sprains which means damage to the lateral ligaments. Inversion is much more common because of the available support your body can give when in an inversion ankle injury. Once your weight is distributed to your leg and already into the sprain, the only possible way for your body to go is either on the ground or exerting more force into your ankle if you don’t fall. Compare that to eversion sprains where your ankle rolls outward and pressure is put to the inside of your leg. Once your ankle rolls that way, most of the pressure will be put through your ankle which will leave you either to fall on the ground, or have your other leg support you. Most of the times if someone is ever in the process of an eversion sprain, their other leg will maintain balance and take the stress off of the rolling eversioned ankle.
Any second or third degree tears will take a very long time to heal back to one hundred percent capacity because ligaments are very avascular. That means there will be very little blood flow to those areas so the healing process can be months. This is one of the major problems with sprains, but there is more that can hold back people that are recovering from this injury. With any second or third degree comes swelling of the ankle and lower extremity, bruising around the sprained area, and a high degree of tenderness and pain.
Another problem with ankle sprains is a high probability of reoccurrence. Once an ankle is sprained, it will never regain to it’s potential one hundred percent health, but it can come very close to it with proper treatment. Once a person sprains his/her ankle, that person needs to tend to it as a serious injury, because it can be very debilitating.
When tending to a sprained ankle, one of the, if not the most, important phases is direct and immediate care after the sprain. One very common management for ankle sprains and other injuries is RICE. That stands for Rest Ice Compression and Elevation.
Applying ice around the ankle will help decrease blood circulation and edema. The ice around the ankle also helps decrease the person’s pain level by desensitizing the nerve endings to that area. Keeping edema to a minimum is one of the main focus points, so also elevate the ankle above heart level. To elevate the ankle above heart level, have the person lie down on his/her back and place support underneath the leg to prop it up at least six inches above the ground. Another form of decreasing edema is compression.
So after ice is applied, there should be some sort of compression around the joint area to keep excessive edema from that are. The easiest method is using some sort of wrap that can start from at least mid-foot to the top of your ankle. The reason you want to start so low and end so high is because swelling won’t just occur at the exact place of the sprain. Swelling also occurs in areas around the joint if the tear is bad enough, from the toes to the calf is usually the ends where swelling occurs. After a sprained ankle, that person should also look into getting ankle support through some sort of bracing system. There are many types of braces depending on the degree of ankle sprain and the support needed. On any first degree sprain and minor second degree sprains, if the person takes care of their ankle properly and soon after the time of injury, a store bought brace usually does the job fine. For more severe second and third degree sprains, usually the person should first see a doctor. Many times a brace will have to be ordered that gives more support and customization to that person’s ankle.
If someone receives a third degree sprain, that person will most likely undergo surgery to reattach the ligaments. Without surgery, recovery is almost impossible and a slight handicap will be almost inevitable.
After these type of sprains, some sort of physical therapy or reconditioning of the ankle is very necessary because the ankle has lost it’s range of motion, weakened, and most likely muscle mass around that area has decreased because lack of use. All of this can be regained one step at a time going to physical therapy to treat it as needed. Without this post-treatment, spraining the ankle again is very likely because of the weakened joint.
Reference Page
“Ankle Sprain.” ePodiatry.com. 18 Apr. 2005 http://www.epodiatry.com/ankle-sprain.htm
Rimando, MD, CSCS, Marlon. Ankle Sprain.eMedicine.com. 18 Apr. 2005 http://www.emedicine.com/pmr/topic11.htm
Foster, Ray. "Acute Ankle Sprains." eMedicine.com. 20 July 2004. Department of Orthopedic Surgery, Loma Linda University School of Medicine. 20 Apr. 2005 http://www.emedicine.com/orthoped/topic373.htm
L i n k
Also, yes, I have sprained my ankle. It was when I was learning barfly, I was exhausted, but Brad was pushing me to keep trying. Remember when you are exhausted and are trying difficult moves, you don't have the same body control like when you are freshly shredding, so be careful. I came down after dexing and heard a big ole 'crack'. I'm pretty sure it was a second degree sprain with some tearing of my lateral ligament, but I immediately took care of it. I was out for about 2 months. Then after that, I messed up my knee, and had knee surgery, so there was a couple more months.
Make sure like others said, to take your time getting back into things, I'll post my little write up on ankle sprains to give you all some ideas about how severe they can be, and what you should do. Sorry for the large write up, but hey, here is some info !
A large percentage of ankle injuries observed in outpatient physical therapy clinics are ankle sprains. These common ankle sprains are usually from some sort of sudden traumatic rolling of the ankle. With this roll, all force is then applied to one certain ligament that gives out, which causes stretching and tearing of the fibers that make up certain ligaments. Ankle sprains occur in just about all ages, but still fit into certain categories. Athletes are more prone to ankle sprains because of the constant exertion they put through there body which travels to the ankles. Some examples of athletes that are more liable to sprain there ankle are any athlete that is in a sport where there is fast pivoting such as; basketball, football, freestyle footbag, tennis, etc.
Another group that is more liable to sprain their ankle is the elderly or people that are deconditioned and/or overweight. The elderly usually don’t have the same proprioception as younger adults, therefore giving them more possibility to loose balance and sprain their ankle. The elderly are many times more deconditioned than normal adults, so their muscles and balance aren’t what they used to be. If you add on obesity, there is added weight to balance out on normal activities that have more potential to sprain your ankle such as; walking on hills, walking on bumpy terrain, etc.
These ligaments manage all of our body weight onto this crucial joint, so that is why ligament damage to the ankle is so common. A sprain can be described in three degrees of severity: 1. Microscopic tears in the ligament 2. more severe tear, but ligament is still attached. 3. Ligament is completely separated from tear.
Almost all ankle sprains are inversion sprains which means damage to the lateral ligaments. Inversion is much more common because of the available support your body can give when in an inversion ankle injury. Once your weight is distributed to your leg and already into the sprain, the only possible way for your body to go is either on the ground or exerting more force into your ankle if you don’t fall. Compare that to eversion sprains where your ankle rolls outward and pressure is put to the inside of your leg. Once your ankle rolls that way, most of the pressure will be put through your ankle which will leave you either to fall on the ground, or have your other leg support you. Most of the times if someone is ever in the process of an eversion sprain, their other leg will maintain balance and take the stress off of the rolling eversioned ankle.
Any second or third degree tears will take a very long time to heal back to one hundred percent capacity because ligaments are very avascular. That means there will be very little blood flow to those areas so the healing process can be months. This is one of the major problems with sprains, but there is more that can hold back people that are recovering from this injury. With any second or third degree comes swelling of the ankle and lower extremity, bruising around the sprained area, and a high degree of tenderness and pain.
Another problem with ankle sprains is a high probability of reoccurrence. Once an ankle is sprained, it will never regain to it’s potential one hundred percent health, but it can come very close to it with proper treatment. Once a person sprains his/her ankle, that person needs to tend to it as a serious injury, because it can be very debilitating.
When tending to a sprained ankle, one of the, if not the most, important phases is direct and immediate care after the sprain. One very common management for ankle sprains and other injuries is RICE. That stands for Rest Ice Compression and Elevation.
Applying ice around the ankle will help decrease blood circulation and edema. The ice around the ankle also helps decrease the person’s pain level by desensitizing the nerve endings to that area. Keeping edema to a minimum is one of the main focus points, so also elevate the ankle above heart level. To elevate the ankle above heart level, have the person lie down on his/her back and place support underneath the leg to prop it up at least six inches above the ground. Another form of decreasing edema is compression.
So after ice is applied, there should be some sort of compression around the joint area to keep excessive edema from that are. The easiest method is using some sort of wrap that can start from at least mid-foot to the top of your ankle. The reason you want to start so low and end so high is because swelling won’t just occur at the exact place of the sprain. Swelling also occurs in areas around the joint if the tear is bad enough, from the toes to the calf is usually the ends where swelling occurs. After a sprained ankle, that person should also look into getting ankle support through some sort of bracing system. There are many types of braces depending on the degree of ankle sprain and the support needed. On any first degree sprain and minor second degree sprains, if the person takes care of their ankle properly and soon after the time of injury, a store bought brace usually does the job fine. For more severe second and third degree sprains, usually the person should first see a doctor. Many times a brace will have to be ordered that gives more support and customization to that person’s ankle.
If someone receives a third degree sprain, that person will most likely undergo surgery to reattach the ligaments. Without surgery, recovery is almost impossible and a slight handicap will be almost inevitable.
After these type of sprains, some sort of physical therapy or reconditioning of the ankle is very necessary because the ankle has lost it’s range of motion, weakened, and most likely muscle mass around that area has decreased because lack of use. All of this can be regained one step at a time going to physical therapy to treat it as needed. Without this post-treatment, spraining the ankle again is very likely because of the weakened joint.
Reference Page
“Ankle Sprain.” ePodiatry.com. 18 Apr. 2005 http://www.epodiatry.com/ankle-sprain.htm
Rimando, MD, CSCS, Marlon. Ankle Sprain.eMedicine.com. 18 Apr. 2005 http://www.emedicine.com/pmr/topic11.htm
Foster, Ray. "Acute Ankle Sprains." eMedicine.com. 20 July 2004. Department of Orthopedic Surgery, Loma Linda University School of Medicine. 20 Apr. 2005 http://www.emedicine.com/orthoped/topic373.htm
More C4 please <3
Ted - it's not so easy - I was doing it for long time. I sprained my right ankle 11 months and 3 days ago. I had a II degre sprain with damaged cartilage. Had gypsum for 2 weeks Then I was off for any activity for 4 months, and then I was cycling for one month, every day. And I was doing all the rehab. and exercises I found in books and on internet. And I'm doing many of them even today... My ankle is just stiff... And when it's tired it's even more stiff. And I feel the pain pretty often...
With my left ankle is it another story, but my main problem is the right one.
With my left ankle is it another story, but my main problem is the right one.
Pawel Ptaszynski
"I know I can! Be what I wanna be.
If I work hard at it, I'll be where I wanna be."
NAS
Be strong, LIVESTRONG
http://www.laf.org
http://www.wearyellow.com
"I know I can! Be what I wanna be.
If I work hard at it, I'll be where I wanna be."
NAS
Be strong, LIVESTRONG
http://www.laf.org
http://www.wearyellow.com
-
SandWraith
- Egyptian Footgod
- Posts: 1272
- Joined: 05 Apr 2005 20:39
- Location: Marshfield, Wisconsin
Well, I haven't had any concerns with whirls, but as far as paradons go, I plan on dialing my DATW's better before I work on those again. It's been two days since the fateful incident with my ankle and the pavement, and I can walk without complain and have pretty good mobility (despite a bit of pain in several directions), so I'm hoping to start hacking this weekend again. What do you think? If I were to classify my sprain, I'd say it's borderline Grade 1 and Grade 2. It hurt the first day, but I could walk on it; now it doesn't hurt to walk on at all; it turned black and blue, but that didn't hurt; and it's recovering very well! I got some of fish oil pills and I'm taking 3 a day now, as well as every other remedy I can find. I'm even keeping a table of the diameter of my swollen appendage, which I'll post up here when I'm done 
Zach Marine - Member of the Tendonitis Club!
blog
blog
haha I was doing a regular ass paradon the other day and damn near fucked myself up. I definitely strained my ankle slightly, but nate said it looked pretty bad. Luckily I fell just right with it and hit the ground with my whole body right after, so I'm fine... even kept shredding that day. I screwed up once over a year ago on a paradox whirl. Landed with the whirling foot, and then my ankle gave out and rolled. I heard a huge pop... I was out for like a week or two.
Ankle injuries suck...
Ankle injuries suck...
Always Shreddin
James Erickson
Eugene Footbag Association (Orton, Nasty, Me)
w/ new additions (Casey, Alex, Eddie, and Shawnell)
James Erickson
Eugene Footbag Association (Orton, Nasty, Me)
w/ new additions (Casey, Alex, Eddie, and Shawnell)
The severity of the injury comes from the angle of your body when it happens (how well you fall) and the previous strength of your ankles.
A lot of people will be able to have a minor injury like this and come out ok, but it will weaken their ankle so the next time it happens it will hurt more.
I have had 4 first degree sprains (2x each ankle) and 1 2nd degree for which I went to the emergancy room because the swelling was so violent I thought it was dislocated.
The first 4 took between 2 days and a month to heal properly, the 2nd degree (the last one i've had) took about 2 months I think.
These move caused each of them:
Right Double over down (1st degree)
Right Butterfly (1st degree)
Right Reverse whirl (1st degree)
Right Barfly (1st degree)
Left side reverse whirl (2nd degree)
I no longer do any moves ending in dex>op clipper delay type notation, this includes:
Butterfly
Whirl
Reverse Whirl
DOD
Paradon
Barfly
This precaution is very limiting on my game but I havent sprained my ankle in like 8 months because of it. For me it is nessisary because my ankles are so weak.
I would advise that all players attempting butterfly make damn sure you can do 20 alternating clippers, when attempting whirl make damn sure you can do as many safe moves that pracitce its motion (eg outside stall atw) and when learning dod make sure you can do 20 alternating butterflys and do not try and jump ahead and learn paradon and barfly before learning dod, you absolutly need to have that basic double dex>clipper co-ordination down first.
What moves have you all sprained your ankles doing?
I have never heard of anyone spraining their ankles on a move that is not one I listed above.
Nic Bathgate.
A lot of people will be able to have a minor injury like this and come out ok, but it will weaken their ankle so the next time it happens it will hurt more.
I have had 4 first degree sprains (2x each ankle) and 1 2nd degree for which I went to the emergancy room because the swelling was so violent I thought it was dislocated.
The first 4 took between 2 days and a month to heal properly, the 2nd degree (the last one i've had) took about 2 months I think.
These move caused each of them:
Right Double over down (1st degree)
Right Butterfly (1st degree)
Right Reverse whirl (1st degree)
Right Barfly (1st degree)
Left side reverse whirl (2nd degree)
I no longer do any moves ending in dex>op clipper delay type notation, this includes:
Butterfly
Whirl
Reverse Whirl
DOD
Paradon
Barfly
This precaution is very limiting on my game but I havent sprained my ankle in like 8 months because of it. For me it is nessisary because my ankles are so weak.
I would advise that all players attempting butterfly make damn sure you can do 20 alternating clippers, when attempting whirl make damn sure you can do as many safe moves that pracitce its motion (eg outside stall atw) and when learning dod make sure you can do 20 alternating butterflys and do not try and jump ahead and learn paradon and barfly before learning dod, you absolutly need to have that basic double dex>clipper co-ordination down first.
What moves have you all sprained your ankles doing?
I have never heard of anyone spraining their ankles on a move that is not one I listed above.
Nic Bathgate.
First sprain was form torque, instead of landing on my toe i sort of landed on the outside of my foot. That made my ankle really weak, and I began rolling my ankle more, and also in addition had a couple other sprains. I've hadn't had any problems for a good 3/4 of a year. This I attribute to doing ankle rotations as given by some people above. And also I've been doing a few different things to work on balance.
"...You have to get, really, practice, like eight hours every day. Then you get good level and then you can compete....There is no money, so players are like big family and that is what I -like" -Vasek-
Reid Strellner
Reid Strellner
I've sprained both my ankles several times, but only once or twice due to footbag. It took anywhere from 3 weeks to a couple months to get them back to playing shape. In only the most recent sprain did I notice any loss of flexibility. I even experience some discomfort executing certain moves while I play. I hope its not due to the sprain as it was about 5 months ago.
Zeke
Funny movie titles if the movie were about poop:
Red
Fast & the Furious
The Green Mile
Children of the Corn
There Will be Blood
Funny movie titles if the movie were about poop:
Red
Fast & the Furious
The Green Mile
Children of the Corn
There Will be Blood
-
Genzu
- Freedom Footbags
- Posts: 331
- Joined: 06 Feb 2003 00:07
- Location: Here, Now. (Which is usually Nampa, ID)
- Contact:
From what you've said, I'd say I've got a simialr sprain. I'm just curious how long you waited before kicking, and how your ankle is now??SandWraith wrote:..., so I'm hoping to start hacking this weekend again. What do you think? If I were to classify my sprain, I'd say it's borderline Grade 1 and Grade 2. It hurt the first day, but I could walk on it; now it doesn't hurt to walk on at all; it turned black and blue, but that didn't hurt; and it's recovering very well! I got some of fish oil pills and I'm taking 3 a day now, as well as every other remedy I can find. I'm even keeping a table of the diameter of my swollen appendage, which I'll post up here when I'm done
Stupid Flying Clipper barefoot, after a couple of beers... I don't advise kicking after beer
. 
Peace.
Daryl "Genzu Blades" Genz
Owner, Freedom Footbags
Please support the IFPA:
http://www.freedomfootbags.com/
Owner, Freedom Footbags
Please support the IFPA:
http://www.freedomfootbags.com/
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SandWraith
- Egyptian Footgod
- Posts: 1272
- Joined: 05 Apr 2005 20:39
- Location: Marshfield, Wisconsin
I sprained my ankle on April 18th and started kicking again on April 28th. At that point I couldn't really do clippers at all anymore on my right ankle-- the flexibility was really shot. After about a week though, I was back to about where I had been before spraining it (mostly 3s and a few easier 4s), minus some minor stuff due mostly to atrophying skills. Now, 2 months later, my ankle doesn't hurt and I have all the flexibility back. If I kick particularly hard for over 3 hours though, it may start to act up on me. Overall though, it seems to have been a full recovery. Good luck, Genzu; I wish you a speedy recovery.
Zach Marine - Member of the Tendonitis Club!
blog
blog
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ShredOnLawn
- Atomsmashasaurus Dex
- Posts: 818
- Joined: 11 Mar 2005 12:44
- Location: Grass Valley, California
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slapdash21
- Futureless
- Posts: 4681
- Joined: 29 Sep 2004 14:50
- Location: Beantown, kidd
tweaked my ankle a bit yesterday working on ducking butter. really stiff and painful most of today, but definitely nothing serious. im not gonna do any serious shred tonight, but i want to seal pdx whirl so bad that im gonna try it a few times tonight. not that bad on my ankle anyway.
peace.
peace.
Pete Bowler
B$C
keeps it offah da ground.
617 FOR LIFE
B$C
keeps it offah da ground.
617 FOR LIFE