Erik Chan, January 2011

Muffinman · Post by **Muffinman** » 05 Feb 2011 01:05

I've been struggling for almost a year to get back to where I was in my game after a year off due to injury. I still have no stamina and can't make runs. So this is all I've got. I've been playing pretty regularly too, so hopefully I get my strings back at some point. I'm happy to be playing at all, but I'm sure others can empathize with losing skill

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5pAbdSUOqg[/youtube]

Jorden · Post by **Jorden** » 05 Feb 2011 08:25

Chan, I love you as a person and as player, but please understand that rotating your knees inwards, turning your hips inwards and landing on your heels is COMPLETELY destroying your body.

Your injuries are NOT a result of bad luck, specific instances or any genetic conditions. It is ongoing, from habits implemented and practiced over many years.

It's hard for me to say this (and I've been holding back for quite some time) because I have so much respect for you and your status in the footbag community. I didn't want to hurt your feelings. But it's because I care, that I thought you should know where your problems are stemming from.

It would be of great benefit to look into something like ballet classes. "Stigma" aside, it really helped me learn how to use my body in a more anatomically correct (and strengthening!) way. Another option would be to have a physiotherapist(?) or similar professional look at your game and give you an analysis on your movements.

The tricks you do are really great and I think it would be in your best interest to learn how to execute them in the safest possible way.

Your friend,
Jorden

Radek · Post by **Radek** » 05 Feb 2011 16:06

I have to say Jorden is thousand percent right. I had similar feelings about the way you do some tricks when I saw couple of yours videos arround a year ago.

I second Jorden's advice and I second Jorden's respect for you.

C-Fan · Post by **C-Fan** » 05 Feb 2011 18:50

I don't see why this couldn't have been done through PMs.

sen · Post by **sen** » 05 Feb 2011 19:02

I have to agree with Ken here. Regardless of what your form might be doing to your body, I enjoy watching you play.

mc · Post by mc » 05 Feb 2011 19:12

loved the pdx blenders! great to see a video from you buddy!

Zeb Jackson · Post by **Zeb Jackson** » 05 Feb 2011 21:34

C-Fan wrote:I don't see why this couldn't have been done through PMs.

i agree

that being said, i love watching all of your videos eric, you have put out a lot of good ones throught the years that have inspired me to play. I like this one a lot, you look pretty good in it to me

Jorden · Post by **Jorden** » 05 Feb 2011 23:36

C-Fan wrote:I don't see why this couldn't have been done through PMs.

Simple. Because I'm an asshole!

Blind praise and notions to "keep pushing", although great for the self esteem, do NOT encourage the safety and overall wellbeing of a player.
They way we progress is by improving our weak points, esp in areas related to safety and injury prevention. Bringing these notions to light are much more helpful and socially responsible.
The key rule is that the criticism should always be objective.

My hope is that knowledgeable players will assist those when necessary and further set the example.

JM

Rieferman · Post by **Rieferman** » 08 Feb 2011 05:22

Whether you're a hacky sack superstar, or not, my opinion is that the cool thing to do in a case like this one is to PM the player saying "I have some advice for you, do you want it? Would you prefer I post it publicly or privately?". Had the original post asked for advice on form, then have at it. Go ahead and rip me if you'd like.

--------

Anyways, my reason on posting actually was to say that I always like seeing your vids Erik and this one is no exception. Keep kicking

Jazzkid · Post by **Jazzkid** » 08 Feb 2011 07:42

Erik....Thanks for posting and I wish your game and your health MUCH LOVE

That being said......(the following is obviously debatable)
The risk and benefits of posting anything on a public forum is that you will receive compliments, negative remarks, and in this case ...constructive critics. There is sort of a responsibility to everyone to sometimes make these remarks public.....and Jorden must have felt obligated to do so. I am actually curious of what he meant about turning your hips in.. As a music student I have met many different teachers that other students did not like because of their honestly. As a student (which we ALL are), we must be willing to here these critiques and then (most importantly) try to fix the problems. The advice on classes and having someone check out your game is AWESOME and hope it helps you shred longer and healthier in life.
The only thing that sucks....is that no one told you sooner.
Mark

JM,
I need this critic all over my game ...publicly or privately.
Mark

h0ag3yb3atZ · Post by **h0ag3yb3atZ** » 08 Feb 2011 07:52

good vid. reverse gary coleman>reverse mullet was a fresh link that I'm gonna steal. pdx blenders look sharp too.

I feel you on the injury front. I haven't been healthy since May so clearly I'm doing something wrong but you just gotta keep at it. I definitely wouden't mind some criticism, especially from someone like Jorden.

looking forward to more video.

Jorden · Post by **Jorden** » 08 Feb 2011 09:26

If nothing else, it's nice to stir some sort of life and passioned debate back into the modified graveyard.

If constructive criticism (which is positive, much different than trash-talking) is restricted to only PMs, then 2 important effects are lost:

1) With constructive criticism comments, players learn to spot form errors in videos. They can then study videos with comments criticizing form and compare with videos where the form is praised and relate it to their own game. Their technique can then be structured in the best possible way. Otherwise, we can emulate the mistakes from our idols without knowing.
2) After spot recurring errors, players can then give correction and objective advice to other players in their videos. The cycle continues and everyone benefits!

I remember when footbag forums were supplements to training rather than just social support groups.

As always, if any of you want help with your game, send me a recent video and I'll do my best to find improvements for you.
Being too shy is your loss!

JM

(Hips turned inwards is basically feet beyond shoulder width, feet turned in and knees not over top of feet, knees close together)

Muffinman · Post by **Muffinman** » 08 Feb 2011 11:13

Since you didn't answer my questions in PM, maybe you can answer here. I have no money for dance lessons, nevermind to pay my phone bill, so that is not an option for me right now. Like Mark said, this insight from you is invaluable, but it doesn't help me much if all I am told is, "You're doing it wrong." Here were my questions:

me wrote:Hey Jorden.

Thanks for the advice and insight in the video thread. I really appreciate it. Do you think that you could go into a bit more detail about what I am doing that's looks bad for me? Is it mostly my reverse whirls and double downs? Is there anything else? Can you think of anything that I could do to improve my footbag health in these regards? If it's just those two tricks I'm down with cutting them from my repertoire altogether and focusing more on spinning and ducking... maybe learning torques better. (Drifters hurt my hips...)

I can see the turning of the knees. I'm not sure what you mean by the turning in of the hips, though.

I'd appreciate any further advice you could give me!
Thanks again Jorden!

Best,
Erik

Jorden · Post by **Jorden** » 08 Feb 2011 12:53

Erik, where are you living now? Toronto??

If so, let's arrange a day to get together. I'm back in Canada March 1st.

F[uns]tylin' Eclectic · Post by **F[uns]tylin' Eclectic** » 08 Feb 2011 18:57

I thoroughly enjoyed this video, Erik. I feel like I sometimes have a similar problem with inverting my knees. I kind of fixed it now, but I think it still haunts me. Anyway, I really like your style. Oddly enough, I think the double knee braces look cool. It's kind of like saying, "I may be hurt, but I won't give up and I'm going to keep going strong." It's very inspirational, especially to those with past-injuries. Keep it up man.

Muffinman · Post by **Muffinman** » 08 Feb 2011 19:18

Hey Jorden.
I live in Ajax, close to Oshawa, so I'm a good hour's drive from you (Hamilton still?). I do have a car sometimes, though, so maybe we can make a weekend day of it in the future? Maybe we can arrange something close to when you are back. That would be swell. Until then I plan to not use reverse whirls or double downs.

Muffinman · Post by **Muffinman** » 08 Feb 2011 19:32

Also, thanks for all the comments guys!

Rieferman · Post by **Rieferman** » 09 Feb 2011 04:54

Jorden - I understand your point to be that you have a social responsibility to point out form flaws etc. Therefore, since the form topic has been opened already, rather than save your form-fixing advice for a solo session with Erik, it would logically follow that you post that advice in this thread so that we can all learn from your expertise.

C-Fan · Post by **C-Fan** » 09 Feb 2011 10:49

I agree with Bob.

If your intention all along was to work one on one with Erik, you could have saved him some humiliation by setting up a private session via PM, or giving him advice directly through PMs.

If your intention was to use this video as a teaching opportunity for modified as a whole, then you should have posted your advice in this thread.

To publicly call out Erik's style in this thread only to conclude by setting up a private session with him doesn't help others out at all. It only needlessly embarassed Erik.

cd · Post by cd » 09 Feb 2011 13:15

Take it to PM's, guys.

Erik, I liked the bsos scorp. That was probably my favorite combo. I'm looking forward to when you're back in shape and doing longer strings.